Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes
My apologies for the David Bowie reference, but major changes seem to be in order as a result of this latest disappointment and early exit from the postseason. I'm not exactly going out on a limb to say that it's going to be a very busy week in the Bronx, beginning first thing tomorrow morning.
Here are some questions to ponder while we vent our frustrations:
1.) Who will be managing the Yankees next season?
2.) Will [Should] Brian Cashman keep his job as the GM? If not, who should replace him?
3a.) Will A-Rod be back?
3b.) Posada?
3c.) Mo?
3d.) Pettitte?
3e.) Abreu?
4.) What other changes do you expect to see (or want to see) for next season?
A few of these questions may be answered within days (manager) or weeks (A-Rod), so we will not be lacking topics of discussion on PA anytime soon.
Shamefully, A-Rod is going to get most of the media coverage blame for his team's lackluster performance and it may be the final straw that drives him out of town. What should not be overlooked is the fact that True YankeesTM Wang, Jeter, and Posada were all downright offensive in their own right. Damon and Cano did okay, but that's about it for the rest of the Yankee offense.
It also doesn't help when only four Yankee pitchers were successful in getting opposing hitters out in the series (Pettitte, Hughes, Chamberlain, and Mo).
As for the ALCS, all I can say is Go Tribe! I no longer care what happens the rest of the season as long as the Red Sox aren't the last team standing at the end of October.
0 recs |
168 comments
Comments
Bad Karma
by matthaggs on Oct 8, 2007 11:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
For the record....
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Too soon for that discussion
Anyone else have a sickening feeling that the Red Sox are going to destroy the Indians?
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Sorry but please link
by garp on Oct 8, 2007 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know you aren't very bright
As for Wang, I didn't that shit coming, but I can't say I am all that surprised. He isn't an ace.
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fact is that you have criticized
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wang
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can't be surprised at the offense
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we have seen it for four years
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well mainly because Igawa,
Also, I don't remember you being one of the "let ARod walk" supporters.
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anything but
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting. So if they spend all
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 7:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well it certainly won't have a
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with that
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crazy
by costa on Oct 10, 2007 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Excuse me
How many hits did Arod have?
He didn't have a great series, he had an average series. The pitchers for Cleveland. Let's complain about something else and resign our star.
Like it or not, we need him.
by Cbeck3 on Oct 9, 2007 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
There has to be a point where you tell this guy to enjoy life in Anaheim.
I know Posada and Mo are lesser players, but what kind of signal does it send if they let Boras fill out a blank contract then play hardball with a hall of famer and the guy who might have been the most irreplaceable Yankee this year?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/09/sports/baseball/10boras.html?hp
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not at $30M for ten years...
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mmm,
The Yankees will not make the playoffs without A-Rod. Bank on it.
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow...
Amazing.
by AKJoe on Oct 10, 2007 2:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's one more time than you
by pfistyunc on Oct 10, 2007 7:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I know they are vastly different players, but I don't care how well ARod takes care of himself, the Yanks will regret paying a guy $30M a year when he's in his 40's. Unless ARod goes the Barry Bonds route, he'll be a shell of his current self 7 years from now.
Keep the current deal, offer a 4 year, $120M extension. Five years $150 max. With the Texas savings still in place that's a more than reasonable deal for both sides. If he says no, tell him thanks for the memories.
And the Yanks could absolutely make the playoffs without him. They did it in '03, and advanced farther than they ever did with his a(not that I'm blaming him or anything).
by matthaggs on Oct 10, 2007 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The '03 Yankees
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nick Johnson? I'm pretty sure the Yanks
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
Giambi had a big regular season, but he was a broken down mess in the postseason of '03. He batted 7th in Game 7 (granted he hit two homeruns), and he couldn't play in Florida.
He can be replaced. In fact, he can replace himself. He's healthier now than he has been since then.
I see your Nick Johnson and I raise you Robinson Cano. Soriano would have been the guy for you to mention.
Pettitte will be back, and he's not much different than the '03 version. And in Joba and Hughes, the Yankees actually have guys (esp. Joba) who can flat out dominate a lineup in a playoff game, which hasn't happened since Clemens in 2001 (vs. Seattle and then vs. The Mets).
In Damon the '08 team will have a better leadoff hitter, and if Abreu returns he is better than the cast of mopes who played RF in '03 (Karim Garcia anyone?)
The world will not end if ARod plays elsewhere. It didn't end in Seattle, and it won't end here.
That said, I would very much like him back.
by matthaggs on Oct 10, 2007 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what's missing...
by AKJoe on Oct 10, 2007 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting...so you think ARod
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please point
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I said that the Yankees were
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You were arrogant
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that
I'd like to have a little better understanding of why you think this team cannot withstand the loss of A-Rod and still reach the playoffs.
by LateInningRelief on Oct 10, 2007 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You'd be right if the Yankees replaced
Texas and Seattle both improved when he left. You are assuming that the FO will do nothing if he goes. That is lunacy.
P.S. Your last sentence there could be construed to mean that you think ARod is bigger than the Yankees by the way.
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anything can happen in a short series
I also find it a little intellectually dishonest to say that the Yankee's "softball" lineup lead to their demise in the playoffs when the Indians employed a similar type of lineup.
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 12:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Softball lineup
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 7:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Firstly
Secondly, the Tribe has CC and Fausto ready to roll. Dice K and Wakefield suck, and Okajima looks shaky. It will be a long series. Boston might win on the strength of Beckett, but it won't be easy. The Tribe should skip Westbrook.
by matthaggs on Oct 8, 2007 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice try
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ALCS
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ahhhh
by stillmonster on Oct 9, 2007 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
they don't make it
it doesn't make them world beaters.
The tribe will give them fits.
by beantownbosoxh8er on Oct 9, 2007 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not true
But you can't make a dozen wrong predictions throughout the season and then pat yourself on the back when one turns out to be right.
That's like filling out a dozen brackets with a dozen different champions for March Madness.
by anaconda on Oct 8, 2007 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have already explained myself on this
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A nice low blow
I'd recommend that you ask Jscape or Amato if you don't believe me.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is that a low blow?
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The low blow
I can delete an entire comment, which I've done with trolls causing a nuisance, but that's it.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anaconda's right.
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Understood
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have no idea
The source of your information couldn't be more wrong.
Hey, we can agree to disagree on the other stuff. But I don't appreciate these unwarranted conspiracy theories.
You are the last person who should be complaining of PA moderators prohibiting you from speaking your mind.
Look, we don't want to go down this road. If you want to further address this issue, drop me an email.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not about me
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It has never happened
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If your "predictions" were of any value,
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And your explanation
Dice K will be awesome - WRONG
JD Drew will make Boston's offense great: WRONG
The Yanks will lose to the Sox by 10 games: WRONG
Detroit will win the Wild Card: WRONG
The Yankees season is over, they have no chance to make it (many times): WRONG
If you have so many stupid predictions, I guess one of them might be half right. Nice job, congrats.
And please write down for all of us how Paul Byrd is a superior pitcher to Chien Ming Wang.
Yes, Cleveland has pitchers that are better than some or most of the Yankee pitchers, but the Yankee pitchers went pitch for pitch with them in Game 2, and we couldn't hit Paul fuckin' Byrd tonight. They couldn't hit good pitchers, they couldn't hit bad pitchers (except for Westbrook - and that was aided by Trot in RF.) They couldn't hit shit. That was the problem.
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Get out your Twister mat, everyone!
JD Drew will make Boston's offense great: Never said that either. I said that the combo of Drew/Lugo was a significant upgrade over Nixon/Gonzalez. Even with both of those guys have down years, that is still true.
The Yanks will lose to the Sox by 10 games: Still surprised that one didn't happen since they are a significantly better team than the Yanks right now. I guess I didn't foresee injuries to Manny, Ortiz and shit years from Lugo and Drew.
Detroit will win the Wild Card: Admittedly wrong there. I expected them to get a bigger boost from Zumaya and Rogers and that was also before Sheff got hurt.
The Yankees season is over, they have no chance to make it (many times): As I have clarified a million times, to me making the wild card and getting bounced in the first round is just as beneficial as not making it. I abide by the Steinbrenner Doctrine in that regard.
You are right about the Yankee offense shitting the bed in the playoffs, just like I said it would.
Finally, my "I told you so" is based solely upon my prediction of what would ultimately happen to the Yanks this year. That was made days after Detroit bounced us and it was just as accurate then as it is now. I know everyone is pissed that the Yanks shit the bed again this year, but don't blame me for warning you all it was coming.
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha
You said the addition of JD Drew was another good signing by Theo, and his presence in the lineup would be significant (and that's paraphrasing you mildly). WRONG AGAIN.
Refresh my memory on the Yankees record against Boston the last 10 times they played them. The Yanks match up perfectly against them. They beat them with Manny and without Manny, so don't play that card.
While you may abide by the Steinbrenner doctrine, that is not what you meant when you said several times, even after they recovered from the awful start, that they would not make the playoffs.
Sorry bro, but the only pats on the back you're gonna get are from yourself. Anything from Wang - ANYTHING, and just a few hits from the best hitters in baseball wins this series. Nice try though, I applaud your blind arrogance.
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your meager attempts to misconstrue my posts
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing is misconstrued
I think most of PA would side with me. And since no one usually sides with me, I would take that as a sign that you are the one who is off base.
Keep trying to cram that square prediction into a circle.
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If your "predictions" were of any value,
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Proud but bummed
I'm not a Torre loyalist, and I think he's terrible with the bullpen management, but to be honest I don't think Donnie is the answer, and I' not sure Girardi has the makeup to thrive in NYC. I think I want Torre to stay--but only because I don't see a suitable replacement at this time.
I think Abreu is likely to go--but I'd take him if the price dropped to say $12mill.
Arod, I heard David Justice say he believes Arod's going for the money--no surprise when Scot Boras is your agent. I'd make a serious run at him provided he wants to stay. Despite the fact that he'll never be a leader, the Yankees need Arod's bat and glove--plain and simple.
Stick with the youth, and try to build a reliable pen without Joba.
by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2007 1:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's been a long time coming
- Joe is definitely gone. Although I think Girardi would be better, Mattingly's going to be the manager next year. Look for a mass exodus from the coaching staff as well.
- Cashman should be fired. But I suspect he'll keep his job.
- A-Rod, Posada, Rivera, and Abreu will be back. Pettitte will retire.
- Some decent middle relief. Maybe a reliable long reliever/spot starter...I'm expecting a starting rotation of Wang, Hughes, Joba, IPK, and Mussina (unfortunately).
by PsiFighter37 on Oct 8, 2007 11:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
PsiFi, you may be right, at least partially...
Cashman will probably be gone.
A-Rod's out of here. The other 3 will stay, but Posada will be moved to 1st. Andy's gone too.
I like your rotation, but they've got to do something on the middle relief.
by GrandEd on Oct 9, 2007 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Management
If we are going to have change let it be significant. putting in Mattingly is no better than leaving Torre, since he has been his pupil. Lets not forget that Donny has never won a ring. He may be jinxed. Lets really clean up. If we want a former Yankee lets get PAUL O'NEILL. Now there is a winner!
by StrappedYankee on Oct 10, 2007 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
May be in the minority here.....
I don't care who the manager or GM is - they can't make them HIT.
And it was a miracle itself that they even made the playoffs........
by JARNJ3 on Oct 8, 2007 11:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
coming from someone
I believe that the staff will stay the same, only that Mattingly will be the skipper.
Cashman stays- he didn't play.
A-rod,Mo, Rivera, Abreu,Pettitte all back.
I really think with this experience and the players the team/farm has there will be no glaring need....
by beantownbosoxh8er on Oct 8, 2007 11:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I would consider
by pfistyunc on Oct 8, 2007 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think so
Hopefully the TJ kids can come and help by mid season.
by beantownbosoxh8er on Oct 9, 2007 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bullpen in the second half?
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i forgot to
by beantownbosoxh8er on Oct 8, 2007 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel your pain
by mrljdavid on Oct 9, 2007 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
An unknown factor
I do think Torre's history; I think A-Rod is doubtful; Cashman probably stays; Abreu's option probably won't be picked up. The rest will probably stay unless they don't want to play for Joe's successor, who I think will be Girardi. Mattingly doesn't have the experience or the kickass attitude Steinbrenner will probably want in contrast to Torre. I think Bobby Valentine might be considered if Girardi doesn't get it.
by flipster on Oct 9, 2007 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re:
- Donnie Baseball
- Yes, Cashman will and should return. The good he's done for this team more than outweighs a handful of bad free agent signings. Without the influence he's had on the way the club operates, Hughes, Chamberlain and Kennedy would be long gone, traded away for more washed-up power hitters.
- I say A-Rod, Posada, Mo, Pettitte and Abreu all come back. I certainly think they all should.
- OK, maybe trading Matsui for Santana was a dumb idea. But I still think he's our best trading chit in that he carries a lethal bat but, because of how important Damon has become and how stuck we are with Giambi, is dispensable. We should trade him for pitching. It's hard to build bullpens because you really never know who's going to be reliable, but bolstering our bullpen has got to be priority number one. We need to call up our best prospects from the minors and add a couple of veterans who can actually anchor the pen. That plus a rotation of Wang, Pettitte, Hughes, Joba, Kennedy, with Moose as the long man and spot starter, and we're set up much better for next year than we were for this.
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 12:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wang
Jeter was terrible this series. His inability to go left on defense hurt almost as much as his bat. The Yanks should move him to right and let Bobby move on.
Posada should be moved to first. Teams are fearless on the bases against us. This is not the 90's Yanks that can allow cheap runs on things like small ball advances, and passed balls.
Keep A-Rod and keep him at third. We've fucked with this guy enough.
Trade Giambi, impossible I know, but maybe we could get Oakland to take him for something if we eat his money, maybe the damaged Harden? If not cut him and eat the money. He's bad, bad karma, much worse than Alex in my opinion.
Make Matsui the full time DH, and get him a first base glove.
Get Pettitte back at all cost. No explanation needed.
Fill out the rotation with Hughes, Joba, IPK, and if we can get him Santana, if not try for a one year John Smotlz, or Curt Schilling deal. Either one is a huge upgrade over Moose.
Absolutely bring Mo back. Again, no explanation needed.
by yankee come lately on Oct 9, 2007 12:46 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
No fucking way
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
plus..
by BobbyNYC on Oct 9, 2007 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As for Wang
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If that's true, he should have said something...
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's not how athletes think
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wang isn't hurt
I'm certain it'll get fixed, but I'd be looking at his balance at the top of his delivery, his stride and arm slot. It's one or more of those things. It's not a health issue with Wang.
by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2007 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What does "keep A-Rod" mean?
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 12:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He already makes an exorbitant sum
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Try to sign him
by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2007 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Smoltz signed an extension with Atlanta
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 7:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shuffling
Arod to short, Jeter to left, Damon to DH, take Abreu's option, trade Matsui (Giambi if you can), sign Lowell to 3B. What about 1B- are people now satisfied with Minky? I saw someone last night comparing him to Brosius, Tino, Paulie, and Knoblauch (I assume the good incarnation of the latter.) Put Andy back there when he's recovered? Or re-sign and move Posada to 1B and somehow find another catcher? Has Posada even said whether he wants to move to 1B?
by SP on Oct 9, 2007 9:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about?
Cano to 3rd.
AROD to Shortstop.
by AKJoe on Oct 9, 2007 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
go rockies
by narcpress on Oct 9, 2007 1:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Dancing with the stars
by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2007 1:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another quasi-random thought
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 1:14 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i dont know
a) 3 hits in 11 innings in game 2.
b) 2 runs off paul byrd in an elimination game.
pretty hard to not blame the offense at least 90% for this early playoff exit.
by Clutch like Leyritz on Oct 9, 2007 6:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But my point is
by DocBrown82 on Oct 9, 2007 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two random thoughts
- Do you think there is any chance they can convince Moose to accept a trade to an NL team, perhaps Philly?
- Damon or Matsui have to be traded because we are stuck with Giambi's bloated contract. Perhaps Seattle would take Matsui for one of their bullpen guys? If the Soriano trade was any indication, Bavasi can be fleeced.
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 7:17 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Matsui needs to go
by John Amato on Oct 9, 2007 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are we on a budget or not?
- Joe is out, no debate. Mattingly is in, but not a given.
- Cashman stays, the youth movement is his baby, at least enough of his baby to save him
- A-Rod will be back at a cost but one I think we can live with in 2008-2011 but the impact on the team in 2012-1015 is more questionable.
Mo? Not as vaulable as he has been, it is more a question of the Yankees doing right by him. If he wants 2 years give him two years but adjust the salary. Try to give him an incentive based package.
Andy? I'd love to see him back, especially on a 1 year deal. That gives you an option when Mussina breaks down, an option that isn't called Igawa...
Abreu? Nope. Melky, Damon and Matsui are good enough for me. If we could lose Giambi sure but we can't
4) Our biggest problem wasn't relief pitching, it was starting pitching. Both in the post season and in the regular season. The starting pitchers lasted 4-5 innings only far too often. That implied a much higher than reasonable call on teh bull penn. Now with 3 young starters lined up (if Pettitte or Mussina doesn't come back) and limits on their innings we really need more relief for 2008, but the underlying problem is starting pitching not lasting long enough. The problem is that relief pitchers aren't reliable in the first place, they don't gove you many innings per dollar. Farnsworth and Vizcaino combined for 140 innings and cost $8.5m. Pettitte gave us 215 innings and cost $16m. Compare the quaility and we can see why spending on relief pitching is a bad idea.
by TLVP on Oct 9, 2007 7:17 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Don't Change Much
by stusviews on Oct 9, 2007 7:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think
I really don't know how to get Johan or who to trade for him, but I believe it's an imperative for this off-season. He hates being in MIN and would probably love to be on a team that has a chance.
Just imagine a rotation of Johan, Pettitte, Wang, Hughes and Joba (notice no Moose - he needs to go someway, somehow; perhaps part of a Johan trade, if he'd agree?)
A-Rod must be kept at all costs. He's vital to our offense.
Abreau's option should be picked up for one more year, then that's it. He could be used for trade bait, for the right player.
Posada should be signed, but we need to develop the next generation from within (which begs the question, who's in our system?)
Mo should get two more years.
I suspect Girardi will be interviewed for the manager's job. No telling on whether or not he'll take it, or if Mattingly feels that he's ready to assume command. But Joe is definitely gone - and I'm sad about that, despite his misuse of the bullpen. He's been the manager for a good long stretch, and has guided the team through some terrific - and not so terrific - years. He'll be in the Hall of Fame for sure. His number should also be retired, which I suspect it will be when all's said and done.
Goodbye, Joe, and thanks for all the memories.
by docgonzo on Oct 9, 2007 7:33 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This Johan crap has got to stop
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 8:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what if matsui was included
by Clutch like Leyritz on Oct 9, 2007 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
look at from the other side
by glennszy on Oct 9, 2007 8:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Clutch was kidding
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
JOBA in the starting rotation
by glennszy on Oct 9, 2007 8:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i'm still sick to my stomach
by glennszy on Oct 9, 2007 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Look at his minor league numbers
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please
Yanks and prospects
by PinstripePowerhouse on Oct 9, 2007 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
can only go by what i saw
by glennszy on Oct 9, 2007 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't need them
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Start here
Joba made it to AAA as a starter before getting switched to relief. 7 starts at A, 7 at AA, and 1 at AAA. He doesn't have a ton of IP because he was on very strict pitch counts and innings limits.
But check out his batting average against (under .200) and his ridiculous K:BB ratios.
He should be a starter next year.
by jscape2000 on Oct 9, 2007 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
1. Who will be managing the Yankees next season?
by stlyankeefan on Oct 9, 2007 9:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
that's just rumor mill stuff
by glennszy on Oct 9, 2007 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Torre
Cashman:
What can I do for you Arod?
Arod:
I got something to say
(steps to podium)
I don't know if it'll make a difference, but I've decided to play ball for the Yankees again.
(big applause)
But there's just one thing. I play, Coach stays. He goes I go.
Toronto skank:
I think we should vote again!
Why can't life be more like Hoosiers?
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 10:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I always imagined more of a "Tor-re"
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That works too
Probably get a calzone stain on them.
by matthaggs on Oct 9, 2007 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand why the Boss
However, it seems to me that letting Torre go could end up being very very counterproductive in the pursuit of his ultimate goal because of the other dominoes that may also fall as a result.
This team will be fine in the long run if they execute the current plan by injecting youth into the rotation starting with Joba, Hughes, and perhaps Kennedy.
The rotation is the primary reason why this team hasn't been back to the World Series since 2003 and I don't see a significant dismantlement as the solution to the problem.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't matter who they have manage
by pfistyunc on Oct 9, 2007 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It could....
I don't think we should underestimate the loyalty between Torre and his players and I think there is some substance to the argument of a "mass exodus."
We'll know some of the answers to these questions soon enough.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jorge and Mo
Now if Torre gets a job someplace, then I'll worry.
by jscape2000 on Oct 9, 2007 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mo played for Showalter too
I think the odds of them leaving are slim, but it's not impossible.
by anaconda on Oct 9, 2007 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
asdf
by malkmusisgod on Oct 9, 2007 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
IF possible...
by BobbyNYC on Oct 9, 2007 12:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Abreu should stay
by malkmusisgod on Oct 9, 2007 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe Torre: Time to Go, or Hell No?
by gozer on Oct 9, 2007 12:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The biggest issue isn't
We can't really beat up on the offense for this series. Look back at all the WS teams in the 90s. They won with less run support because we could win a 1-2 run pitching duel.
I'm less concerned with keeping A-Rod than getting a real ace. Last year we had a thunderous lineup. Big deal. I don't think we're ready to build an offense around Cano and Cabrera, but we really cannot go into 2008 expecting Wang, IPK, Hughes and Chamberlain to carry most of the load.
It'd be great to get Pettitte back, but he's not the guy. Santana, Sabbathia, Lackey, Peavey & Penny are all free agents following next season. Can we put together any trade packages that will land us one of these guys?
by LateInningRelief on Oct 9, 2007 1:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Lackey can't pitch at
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right, 'cause that really matters
Lackey is an ace and the Yanks would be very fortunate to snare him from the Angels.
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see what kind of ace he is
by garp on Oct 9, 2007 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd hardly call
You're going to discredit a Cy Young candidate because he's had bad luck in Boston. Amazing. I guess Santana sucks too because of his 6.89 ERA in Fenway. The Yanks should just go after Mark Mulder instead: he's clearly better than Lackey and Santana due to his 2.89 ERA in Fenway.... That makes total sense. <rolleyes>
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bad luck? Then I guess
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you advocating
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uhm...no, but I am advocating
by garp on Oct 10, 2007 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As if
You seem to be forgetting that he had a quality start as the #1 pitcher in the 2006 ALDS and received a win as a result of it. I guess you have a really short memory. If you're going to judge a player based on his limited playoff experience (which I posit is a bad idea) then you should do it fairly.
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow! Now you are arguing that Wang
Lackey's had a great year but an ace? He'll have to deliver a few better seasons to rate that high.
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 1:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A few better seasons?
http://www.baseball-reference.com/l/lackejo01.shtml
Are you telling me that a guy with a career ERA of 3.82, ERAs of 3.01, 3.56, and 3.44 the past 3 years, and over 200 innings in each of those years is not an ace? Are you kidding me?
If all you're doing is staring at wins and losses, then you clearly don't understand pitching. Wins and losses tell you nothing about a pitcher. Pitchers don't win and lose games; teams do.
by Willton on Oct 11, 2007 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Funny thing is if you take out
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uhm...look it up?
2005 against CWS - shelled.
2005 against Yankees - lights out.
2002 against Yankees - lights out.
2002 SFG - not an ace.
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I find it very small-minded
I also find it incredibly small minded to think that a pitcher is only good against the Yankees, and that we should judge a pitcher's postseason performance that selectively. Five games tell you absolutely nothing about a pitcher; three disjointed games tell you even less.
by Willton on Oct 11, 2007 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How many disjointed posts
by pfistyunc on Oct 11, 2007 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good to have you back around
by pfistyunc on Oct 11, 2007 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well since everybody pretty much has
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As far as predicting performance is concerned,
by Willton on Oct 11, 2007 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With that said, if the Yankees
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just when you thought his last post
by pfistyunc on Oct 11, 2007 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, he just wants the last word.
by Willton on Oct 11, 2007 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am starting to feel sorry for you...
by garp on Oct 12, 2007 1:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was terrible
PS: I do appreciate you continuing to prove my point that you are in fact PA's village idiot. Notice no one jumping in to disagree? I like that it is really starting to bug you.
by pfistyunc on Oct 12, 2007 7:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So what happened, pussyboy?
Unlike you, I don't need anyone to defend me. When you made your very public exit from this site, all I saw was a whole lot of "Hosannas" and "Good riddance!" from the masses. Too bad that you are such a fucking loser that you could not stand by your word and stay away. In fact I was right again in my prediction that you would be back as soon as the Yankees lost. Too bad that I could not have been wrong about that.
by garp on Oct 12, 2007 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll jump in
I cannot fathom why 20% of your posts gratuitously bash garp. Do you have a man-crush?
by LateInningRelief on Oct 12, 2007 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not sure if you notice that Fisty
by garp on Oct 12, 2007 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why even bother?
by pfistyunc on Oct 11, 2007 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Got kicked out of your "better"
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for proving my point
by pfistyunc on Oct 11, 2007 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well at least we are in agreement
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As to Wang
by Willton on Oct 11, 2007 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was not there best pitcher by
by garp on Oct 11, 2007 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
By the way, you changed the subject
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Forgetting ...
But we've got more power arms on the way as well. What we need to do is stay the course. Cashman and company have restocked the shelves, and we need to see who fits where before packaging players for mega-$$$ pitchers.
Remember Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz and Avery??? I really think we have guys who can approach their collective level of greatness--provided we don't screw up and trade them away.
From what I understand, we've got good bullpen talent in the AA, AAA levels. Let's see what they've got come Spring.
by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2007 2:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I totally agree that we don't
by LateInningRelief on Oct 9, 2007 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Leave the mentoring to the coaching staff
by Willton on Oct 9, 2007 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fine forget mentoring
by LateInningRelief on Oct 9, 2007 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's not his job
by Willton on Oct 10, 2007 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wrong:
Ancient rule of life.
by LateInningRelief on Oct 10, 2007 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not worth a big $$$ vet
by Ronster22 on Oct 10, 2007 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is actually the
Even so, a big $$$ vet is, IMO, what stands between us and a rebuilding year.
And Moose may actually be a decent pitching coach one day, but he's so prickly as a competitor I don't know that he'd be a great mentor until he hangs up his cleats.
by LateInningRelief on Oct 11, 2007 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

by 















