New York Yankees News and Notes
If you have a few minutes, take the time to read Alex Geshwand's overview of the Yankees (in)ability to develop quality starting pitchers during Brian Cashman's tenure. His main takeaway:
(I)t’s worth noting how little success the organization has had developing starting pitchers during Brian Cashman’s tenure as general manager. In fact, since Cashman took over before the 1998 season, his system has succeeded in developing exactly one front of the rotation starter.
That would be Chien-Ming Wang, who gave the Bombers three and a half good seasons before tripping over second base in Houston in 2008. Granted, we know that the Yankees paid little attention to the farm system prior to 2005, but even with that said, teams don't actually develop quality starting pitchers that often, and it's even rarer to find ones that achieved at least some of their success with their original organization. Remember, as I've been saying for the past few weeks, most prospects fail.
- Fangraphs give us their take on the Steinbrenners' newly found thriftiness. There's really nothing new in this article, but I like their final point:
The Yankees have long been addicted to overspending, but cold turkey isn’t necessarily the best way to cure it.
- Here's the Yankees B-squad for next season. I like to call it the disaster squad, because if two of these guys are in the lineup with any degree of regularity, that's what the season will probably be.
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I worry about our farm system every day
is there something we’re doing wrong, or is it just the product of bad luck, power struggles and a lack of high draft picks. While other teams go through cycles, we have stayed the same and we are probably the only team that has been consistently so low in the first round that we never get the ‘surer’ prospects and have to rely on high ceiling high risk signing to get elite talent. We’re kind of going against the natural cycle of the rise and fall of talented teams, so we need to adapt to that
Spare me the Cashman hate
How many “front line” starters have been developed across baseball in since 2005? Do you dare to claim there’s been 30 (one per team)? How many of those have grown up in the AL East?
Ivan Nova could be something. Ian Kennedy looks pretty good right now. The Pirates and Nationals make use of our cast offs, while our front line guys (Joba and Phil) struggle in the AL East.
There Is No Such Thing As A Pitching Prospect
Nobody bounds into MLB a fully formed and effective starter. At age 23, Doc Halladay (1st round draft pick, 17th overall)‘s ERA was over 10 in 13 starts. WIth an attitude like Geshwand’s, we would have shipped him to the Brewers for a utility infielder. King Felix (international signing and wildly hyped) posted a WHIP around 1.38 for 3 seasons before he turned the corner and has had 3 great seasons since.
I agree
No matter how good a prospect is coming up through the system, pitchers more than batters need time to adjust to the league and figure out a routine that works for them.
Joba in all likelyhood got gyped of a good chance to be a starter and everyone has given up on him. Hughes looked like a surefire #1 coming up and we see how thats worked out so far. The curse of coming up through the Yankee’s farm system is lack of patience to live up to Yankee standards of excellence.
One problem is the "Yankee Way" isn't conducive to developing pitching
Jscape mentioned Doc Halladay. If he was a Yankee he never would have gotten the opportunity to turn himself around.
The fact that the Yankees are trying to win a World Series every year prevents them from being patient with pitchers. And very few pitchers are good right away. The few that the Yankees HAVE developed and kept over the last two decades – Andy Pettitte, Chien Ming Wang and perhaps Ivan Nova – all pitched well right away, which kept them in the rotation and gave them the opportunity to succeed.
Young pitchers who struggle are either traded away – like Kennedy – or jerked around to the point where they can’t possibly succeed – like Joba and to a lesser extent Hughes.
This doesn’t excuse the Yankees’ ridiculously poor handling of Joba, but it’s hard to develop starting pitching and win 95 games a year at the same time. I’m not sure how to get around this problem. It is a reason, though, why the Yankees shouldn’t be overly protective of their pitching prospects in trade talks. The odds of Banuelos and Betances succeeding here are longer than almost anywhere else.
by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Jan 6, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions
but how many Yankee pitching prospects actually succeeded elsewhere?
Everyone says that the 2000s Yankees traded away all their prospects, but the thing is, very little of them actually amounted to anything, especially pitchers. We traded Jake Westbrook, Tyler Clippard, Randy Choate, Jeff Karstens, Daniel McCutchen, Ross Olendorf and Ian Kennedy. While some of these trades did not work out because of injury, all those trades were worthwhile at the time and most of those guys are not people we really miss.
I read that as Doc Gooden until I read the reply and thought “those numbers cannot be right”
by MichaelGGBGrabow on Jan 6, 2012 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
At least 2 players from the "B Squad"
will see playing time. Nunez figures to play a few times every week in order to give A-Rod and Jeter any needed rest. Jones figures to be the 4th outfielder playing maybe 3 times per week to give the main three a rest.
"I don't want one of those guys who'll drive in two but let in three every game." Casey Stengel
by tnredneckyankeesfan on Jan 6, 2012 9:55 AM EST reply actions
YANKEES
TRADE MONTERO TO THE DODGERS STRAIGHT UP FOR CHAD BILLINGSLY
I agree that rookie pitchers who aren't instant successes have a short shelf life in the Bronx.
I’m surprised Nova was given as long a leash as he got. Ian Kennedy and half the Pirates staff never got that chance when they were Yankees.
I’m equally as surprised as Alex Remington at Fangraphs that the Yankees won’t invest in a one or two year deal for mid- level pitching. I only hope it means the young pitchers will finally get a chance.
by designatedquitter on Jan 6, 2012 10:41 AM EST reply actions
I think that Nova got that leash because the Yanks didn't have any other choice.
Colon was breaking down and the B’s were definitely not ready. I think if the price for Ubaldo wasn’t as high as it was, he might have been a Yankee and Nova would be in AAA this year.
The Yankees and pitching development
The other problem that the Yankees have is that they have been picking at the back of the first round, if not later. The quality of starting pitching prospects at this point are much lower, and require taking high risk high reward types like Cole, Cote, Hughes, Joba, Bleich and Brackman.
2011 – first drafted and signed pitcher – Jordan Cote, pick 118
2010 – first drafted and signed pitcher – Thomas Kahnle, pick 175
2009 – first drafted and signed pitcher – Adam Warren, pick 135
2008 – first drafted and signed pitcher – Jeremy Bleich, pick 44
2007 – first drafted and signed pitcher – Andrew Brackman, pick 30
Now did they miss people they should have drafted? Absolutely. Did they draft low reward college relief arms? Way too much. But they have not had the opportunity to draft at the top of the draft where the more can’t-miss arms are.
It's a combination of late draft picks, lack of patience, pressure in NY. ballpark, pitching in the AL East, and average drafts
I think if a guy like Phil Hughes came up with a team in the NL West he would be at a totally different level by now. Not only would the ballpark and the competition be more favorable but I bet he would have been brought up a little earlier and he never would have gone back and forth to the pen. It also isn’t easy to go out and pitch for the Yankees as a young pitcher with all the pressure and I think being thrown into those situations has a chance to really develop you long term into a real big pressure pitcher(Pettitte) or can negatively affect a pitcher who doesn’t battle through that and just sees the negative results. I don’t think their is any doubt that we have developed and have had top level arms in our system. Joba had as good of stuff as you can really have out of the minors. Where has that gone? I don’t think its a drafting or development issue at the minor league level, I think it’s a combination of mismanagement at the ML level and, honestly, a lack of work ethic in his case(idk where that 98-100 velocity went). Ian Kennedy is a very good ML pitcher right now that we drafted and developed. Would he have done that in NY??? Probably not but, that is a great example of the issue, it’s hard the pitch in NY and in the AL East. It’s why we have to be picky with pitchers in free agency. It’s why we can’t sign a CJ Wilson with confidence he wont be a total bust, John Lackey type signing. Zack Greinke. AJ Burnett. We have such a high standard in the hardest environment to pitch. It’s going to be rare to find guys that succeed or fit those standards.
LoL
If anyone actually thinks that the Yankees are going to stop overspending when they really want or need too, they are out of their goddamn mind.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Jan 6, 2012 2:09 PM EST reply actions
Well, if we are to judge from
this off-season, I’d say they have. For how long is anyone’s guess, but I think it will last for at least another couple of years while we’re burdened with the contracts of CC, Tex, Jeter, Burnett, and A-rod. Cano is gonna get a raise soon, too.
Romine!

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