Who Made the Worst Mistake?
by jscape2000 on Apr 6, 2011 1:00 PM EDT
in New York Yankees Analysis
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There was plenty of blame to go around in last night's loss to the Twins, but who do you think made the worst mistake?
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voted for Girardi not pulling Soriano sooner
Regardless of whether Soriano started the 8th or not, because he pitched Monday night as well and was throwing a lot of pitches last night, I was surprised he wasn’t pulled after there were two base runners.
I’m not going to rehash the arguments about why D-Rob pitching with the bases loaded instead of Rivera was a questionable move, but I will say that I thoroughly do not understand why Girardi often makes the decisions he does (which, unfortunately, often result in less than desirable outcomes).
Lastly, even the YES announcers noticed that Girardi looked concerned after the bases were loaded. If he was concerned, why not pull him before he walks in the first run?
How about Girardi simply not putting Soriano in with a 4 run lead and putting in DRob instead?
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Apr 6, 2011 1:28 PM EDT reply actions
I think there’s something to be said for those with a closer mentality rising to the challenge… and inserting them into a low-leverage situation does seem to produce a lesser result more often than not. It even seems to happen with Mo, and he’s the greatest closer ever.
Why not bring in DRob to start the 8th, and have So available when/if DRob gets into a jam?
Or let CC start the 8th since he was cruiting along, pitching low-stress innings to that point… and bring in So (or DRob, followed by So) if someone gets on base?
Does anyone know where to go to find a stat breakdown based on score?
I’m curious how Mo’s stats with a huge lead (3+, non-save situation) would compare to a small lead (3 or less, save situation), tie game, or losing.
Baseball Reference
I Split G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR SB CS BB SO SO/BB BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+
2 outs RISP 441 653 579 158 120 25 2 12 6 0 66 155 2.35 .207 .297 .320 .617 185 0 8 0 0 14 4 .262 124
Late Close 771 3145 2891 297 613 90 10 38 53 17 178 722 4.06 .212 .264 .290 .553 837 60 32 23 21 32 37 .267 101
Tie Game 181 792 715 64 176 28 4 11 24 7 64 185 2.89 .246 .311 .343 .653 245 10 4 7 2 20 12 .317 137
Within 1 R 443 1954 1770 171 386 48 6 33 46 17 139 452 3.25 .218 .280 .308 .587 545 26 15 22 8 31 25 .273 113
Within 2 R 647 2994 2739 262 606 88 10 43 55 19 194 684 3.53 .221 .277 .308 .585 843 43 24 23 14 33 36 .278 112
Within 3 R 818 3774 3467 322 750 107 11 52 59 20 230 861 3.74 .216 .271 .299 .569 1035 59 36 24 17 33 42 .271 107
Within 4 R 919 4231 3889 359 825 119 13 56 60 20 256 963 3.76 .212 .267 .293 .560 1138 71 42 24 20 34 46 .266 103
Margin 4 R 101 362 347 28 64 4 1 6 2 0 11 92 8.36 .184 .210 .254 .464 88 7 1 0 3 0 7 .230 68
Ahead 817 3396 3156 268 636 88 10 40 25 8 166 788 4.75 .202 .249 .274 .523 864 60 39 16 19 8 37 .254 90
Behind 112 405 365 55 77 7 0 11 13 5 37 82 2.22 .211 .282 .321 .603 117 8 0 1 2 6 4 .241 119
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
@jscape2000
Less readable than I hoped
Direct link: http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.cgi?id=riverma01&year=Career&t=p#clutc::none
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
@jscape2000
thanks
It looks like his stats are about the same in every situation, though the numbers drop sharply for margins >4 runs (that includes games, plate appearances, and at bats). Beyond that, the only blip I noticed is with tied games. Not sure what to make of that except that Mo is a robot who pitches nearly the same way regardless of the situation!
Overanalyzing a fluke loss in early April
is a pretty bad mistake too.
I dispense B.S. and facts. It is up to you to figure out which is which.
Here's my analysis:
Joe botched handling the 8th and 9th, and turned a likely Yankees win into a loss.
Understanding the above isn’t overanalyzing, it’s learning how to prevent the same from happening many more times throughout the season.
Agreed.
It hurts, but if there weren’t 156 more games to play I might be a little more concerned.
"I'm just tryin' to be the great, tryin' to get a piece of cake
Take it offa your plate, eat it right in your face" --Lil Wayne
Yeah...
…I have a feeling the Yanks will be able to catch up with the big bad O’s by the end of those 156 games though.
At least those pinheads up north have been sucking. That makes me happy.
"I'm just tryin' to be the great, tryin' to get a piece of cake
Take it offa your plate, eat it right in your face" --Lil Wayne
I'm just saying that Boston isn't going to suck forever.
We could use all the cushion we can get so that we don’t have to look back at the end of the season when a game could make all the difference and say “hey, remember that game we were winning 4-0 in the 8th and blew it?”. It’s one thing to lose a game you were never in, but it’s another to lose a game like this.
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Apr 6, 2011 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Again, agreed
I just hope we won’t revisit this moment in August and say think WTF went wrong?
"I'm just tryin' to be the great, tryin' to get a piece of cake
Take it offa your plate, eat it right in your face" --Lil Wayne
Or just think. whoops.
"I'm just tryin' to be the great, tryin' to get a piece of cake
Take it offa your plate, eat it right in your face" --Lil Wayne
Would be really strange if we look up at the standings and see the Orioles above us.
It would be like, ’How did that happen again?
Either of the first two choices are valid.
It was clear that Soriano had nothing. If Girardi wasn’t sure, he could have asked Martin and found out. Either Robertson 2 batters earlier or Mariano was a viable alternative.
The 8th inning was the highest ‘leverage’ moment of the game. Using Mariano for a 4 out save would have probably made the score no worse than 4-1 heading into the 9th. As it was, at 4-4, it wasn’t the best use of Mariano Rivera.
Neither Robertson nor Swisher did anything wrong, and Soriano’s ducking the media is a separate issue.
Now, aren’t recriminations fun? This is why the Red Sox fans are having even more fun than we are.
by designatedquitter on Apr 6, 2011 1:34 PM EDT reply actions
Well, fine, but let's count how many he makes. This will be number 1.
Also, lets guess on how many he will make in 162 games. I say 45.
Is it too late to start up the Fire Girardi bus?
People voting for Soriano ducking out on the media really need to re-evaluate their priorities
by Jedi Master A-Rod on Apr 6, 2011 1:48 PM EDT reply actions
an alternative theory
maybe a vote for sori bolting (well, not “for” it, but u know what i mean) reflects a belief that everything else really doesn’t warrant blame. u know, sort of like “what happens in vegas, stays in vegas”. that is, there’s really no second-guessing game decisions in general, and certainly not in this case (although i wonder why there was no “leaving cc in” or “bringing joba in” option listed)…
by sing_or_die_1818 on Apr 6, 2011 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not a HUGE deal
These kinda things happen, even to the magnificent Mo. BUT, these kinda of games need to be limited because the AL Beast looks even tougher this year than in the past. Orioles? Yeah they are gonna be tough. Rays? They will always be a good team for the next few seasons. The Sox are the Sox and the Jays are no push overs either. That means every single game is gonna count in the end. Does anyone seriously expect any team to win the division by more than 3 games this season? Losing the division by a game can make you look back on games like this and say, man if only….
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Apr 6, 2011 1:53 PM EDT reply actions
For me, the biggest mistake was not starting a well rested David Robertson in the 8th
Instead you went to Soriano who threw more pitches than both Joba & Mo the previous night.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 2:10 PM EDT reply actions
But wait, there's more
So threw a lot of pitches, Mo pitched 3 straight games, this was the 4th. CC threw just 104 and put down 17 in a row…clearly he was showing signs of fatigue! After pulling CC too soon, putting in So instead of D-Rob, waiting too long to bring in d-Rob (Mo was not available for a 4 out save) Joe then pulled D-rob too soon so that when the Yanks didn’t score in the 9th Boone Logon was the only option. Too many mistakes, too hard to pick the worst, yet Yanks still lost by just a run. Joe is and always will be a very bad manager on a very good club.
by steelerwheeler on Apr 7, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Ditching the press after you blow it?
Having a bad outing is one thing. Refusing to man up about it is another.
the biggest mistake
was taking out CC at all.. why is this not a choice?
+1
The big man was cruising. Pitch count merans something, but so does the difficulty of the innings… and CC’s innings were low stress. Bring him back and have Soriano ready when/if CC allows a baserunner.
+1
What was CC’s pitch count anyway? I bet he could’ve done just one more inning.
Soriano. Hes supposed to take care of the 8th when hes in.
If he wasn’t rested enough to pitch he wouldn’t have pitched…he did.
Joe Girardi isn’t Joe Torre.
Guitar or die.
by Gelatin on Apr 6, 2011 2:42 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
still
can’t believe you called Joe Mauer a future hall of famer…
I think he meant he has the potential to be one.
Not he IS one right now.
Guitar or die.
by Gelatin on Apr 6, 2011 2:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
well
think of all the don mattinglys and mark mcgwires before you make such a bold statement
by Soriano NY 12 on Apr 6, 2011 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Neither of those two are in the HoF and probably never will be.
Not a big deal its all just speculation. For all we know he might be a future HoF and if he keeps playing the way he has and is capable of then he will be a lock.
Guitar or die.
by Gelatin on Apr 6, 2011 3:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
exactly my point
Neither of those two are in the HoF and probably never will be.
Mauer has played 7 seasons, anything can happen as in the case of Mattingly (injuries) and McGwire (steroids), or just flat out loss of production… are we alrady locking up robbie cano as a first ballot?
by Soriano NY 12 on Apr 6, 2011 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Like I said before, its just speculation. If we’re speculating that he’ll continue to play like the Mauer playing now, he’ll be a HoF.
Guitar or die.
by Gelatin on Apr 6, 2011 3:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, this
Any move that doesn’ t work is automatically wrong – there is always an articulatable alternative that has the benefit of not having been the move that failed.
His fastball was actually pretty good.
It’s one of those annoying pop up basehits that drop into the field. If it had gone a little bit farther, or a little shorter, it would’ve definitely been an easy out, and nobody would be any wiser.
In the long run, I'm over it.
It was a bunch of things that went wrong and it’s time to move on and win some ballgames. Give credit to the Twins for capitalizing on our mistakes, and lets try and take the series.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:08 PM EDT reply actions
All we did, as fans, was discuss what we all think went wrong.
Many things went wrong with that game. It’s been discussed, so it’s really just time to move on and hope these kinds of mistakes don’t happen again.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Even if Girardi takes us to the World Series this year...
He should be fired immediately afterwards. Firing Joe Torre is one thing, but replacing him with Girardi was a bitch slap.
F-U and ROLL TIDE ROLL!
no he shouldn't
Girardi is way better than Torre at actually managing games.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
Oh my god
OK, it’s one loss. ONE loss. And it was a game on APRIL FIFTH!
The bullpen is not going to be perfect every time. Thats a fact. The Yankees still have the best set up man in the league and the best bullpen in the league. Yea, they had a bad game. It’s not fun to lose. But the great thing about baseball is they play again the next night and have a chance to erase it all with a win.
But I am so freaking sick of people blaming Girardi for every single close game the Yankees lose! Honestly, that seems to tick me off more than the loss. Soriano is the eighth inning guy, so he comes in to pitch the eighth. That wasn’t a mistake. Thats what the Yankees signed him to do. He had a bad game. Not Girardi’s fault. In fact I think it was good of Joe to pull him early because he clearly didn’t have it. Now, I suppose the argument could be made that Rivera should have come in instead of D-Rob, but Mo has pitched a lot to start the season, and bringing him in for a 4 out save may not be the smartest thing in the beginning of April. People, Girardi is the manager, he’s not going anywhere, and believe it or not, not all of the losses are his fault.
It’s a LONG season. The bullpen will have some bad games. Yesterday was one of them. Just hope that Garcia can give a quality start today, the bullpen does a good job and the Yankees get the win.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
Thank you!
He was signed to get us through the 8th. Girardi isn’t Joe Torre, he doesn’t throw guys out there who have no arms left.
I haven’t heard anything about Soriano saying he was unrested. Which means he went out to do his job and failed. His fault, let’s move on.
Guitar or die.
by Gelatin on Apr 6, 2011 3:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Again...
Why start Soriano over David Robertson with a 4 run lead? Especially when D-Rob was well rested and Soriano had thrown 19-20 pitches before hand. IMO, that was a mistake on Girardi’s part. It wasn’t even a set-up situation for Soriano. If D-Rob starts to falter, then you bring in So or Mo. I agree that Soriano still could’ve & should’ve gotten the job done and that Girardi is not entirely at fault, but I still believe it was a mistake on his part.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
It doesn't matter
If Girardi had done the exact same thing and Soriano had gotten the outs like he will do the vast majority of the time, then nobody would have had a problem with it.
Because Soriano pitched and didn’t do well, it’s Girardi’s fault for bringing him in? Thats ridiculous. This one was on Soriano, period. He was pitching in a relatively close game in the inning that he is paid to pitch in and he didn’t get the outs. I don’t understand how you can blame Girardi for that simply because it wasn’t a save situation.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
Actually, I still would have had a problem with it.
Whether the decision fails or succeeds does not invalidate my concern or problem over bringing Soriano in the 8th in a non save/non set-up situation. IMO, it’s still early and you want to get some of your players, especially your bullpen, some work and it was a good situation to get David Robertson some work seeing as how Soriano had pitched the night before and the Yankees had a 4 run lead. Yes, Soriano could’ve come in and pitched lights out baseball. He didn’t, it’s done, end of story. I’m not calling for Girardi to be fired. I’m just saying I don’t agree with his decision to bring Soriano in the game in that situation. I didn’t when I saw him come in.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes.
Dumb decisions that work out are just that, dumb decisions. It doesn’t make it not a stupid decision just because it worked out.
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Apr 6, 2011 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
So should have shut them down…then Girardi would have gone with D-Rob in the 9th if up by 4 until it became a save situation…I would guess? Mo should have had the night off unless needed in the 9th. Bringing in So almost guaranteed that wouldn’t happen. So was signed to work the 8th AND be the closer when Mo had pitched 3 days in a row. Win or lose, pulling CC for So in the 8th was moronic.
by steelerwheeler on Apr 7, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
exactly
if Robertson came in and imploded (and he might have, as he was all over the place while he was in), then you could have people second guessing Girardi saying “why not bring Soriano in”?
It’s over, it’s done with. I just hope they can get the win tonight.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
I'd have started the 8th with CC.
The big man was cruising and his innings had been low stress. Why tempt fate? I’d leave CC in to start the 8th, and if someone reached base, go to the bullpen, from which I’d have brought in either Soriano or DRob.
When the game was unfolding, I thought the same thing.
Players screwing up is one thing. If he brought in guys in D-Rob for the 8th and then D-Rob imploded and he tried to clean it up with Soriano and Mo and we still lost, there would not be this type of rage. It would still suck and I’m sure we’d be unhappy, but that’s the nature of relief pitchers. Sometimes they have it and sometimes they don’t.
A manager who has demonstrated a clear pattern of having no bullpen strategy is quite another. The next time that this situation arises, we can reasonably expect better performance from the pitchers, because they’re better players than they showed. Can we reasonably expect Joe to be able to see past what inning it is and use his relievers based on leverage and not some moronic innings formula? Probably not.
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This.
It’s not that we lost (which sucked), it’s the way it happened. If you give it your best shot and lose, there’s no shame in that. If you didn’t give it your best shot, shame on you. We didn’t give it our best shot, compliments of Joe.
Almost stopped reading after this.
OK, it’s one loss. ONE loss. And it was a game on APRIL FIFTH!
Every loss is equal to each other, and what day it occurs on is absolutely completely irrelevant.
**
But I am so freaking sick of people blaming Girardi for every single close game the Yankees lose!
Usually the smart fans do not blame him unless he does something wrong, like last night. He needs to be responsible for his mistakes.
Soriano is the eighth inning guy, so he comes in to pitch the eighth. That wasn’t a mistake. Thats what the Yankees signed him to do
So, let’s say the Yankees are up 7-0. Do you put Soriano in then? What is the decider in when we put Soriano in?
He had a bad game. Not Girardi’s fault. In fact I think it was good of Joe to pull him early because he clearly didn’t have it.
Girardi of course isn’t the one pitching for him, but he shouldn’t have been in the game in the first place and he actually came out too late. Not early. He clearly didn’t have it is right, and Girardi should have pulled him when he realized this.
Mo has pitched a lot to start the season, and bringing him in for a 4 out save may not be the smartest thing in the beginning of April
Until proven otherwise I will continue to believe Mo is indestructible. Also, one extra out should not injure him. If it does, he obviously changed his conditioning or something.
Writer for Pinstripe Alley, MLB Daily Dish
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Lets go Rangers!
R-U! R-U! R-U! R-U!
Also, there was nothing saying he HAD to pitch 4 outs.
He could have gotten the last out in the 8th and then pitched the 9th…or not. The bigger need for him was in the 8th, not the 9th.
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Apr 6, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
…but he’s a closer. Closers are only allowed to pitch the 9th, as they need to get the most magnificent accomplishment in baseball! A “save”
Writer for Pinstripe Alley, MLB Daily Dish
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Lets go Rangers!
R-U! R-U! R-U! R-U!
Goodness gracious, I forgot that sound logic!
If your 2nd best reliever gets in trouble, it’s perfectly reasonable to go to your 3rd/4th best reliever instead of your best!
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Apr 6, 2011 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
How could you forget such an obvious thing!
Writer for Pinstripe Alley, MLB Daily Dish
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Lets go Rangers!
R-U! R-U! R-U! R-U!
I don't know!
Something about formula and Soriano’s ego clouded my judgement.
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Apr 6, 2011 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Mo is our 9th inning guy, but we don’t bring him into a game where we have a comfortable lead.
If I were managing that game, I’d have kept CC in the game to start the 8th, and if anyone got on base, then brought in either Soriano (8th inning guy) or DRob (since Soriano had pitched a fair bit the day before and we had a 4 run lead).
Girardi's to blame ...
Soriano is a closer. How many times have we seen Mo come in to a blow out game to get some work, and he gets his ass kicked alittle. This was no different. Tight game, Soriano will be money. But bring him in to a “non-save” situation in the eighth and this is likely what you are going to get. Girardi should have put in Robertson, or Logan, or the guy from Section 1C, I don’t care. But don’t put a closer into a blow out game.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
If it was actually a blow out
then I guarantee you Soriano wouldn’t have pitched and the Yankees would have won.
A four run lead is not even close to being a blow out.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
It is when it's the Twins ...
They were dead after the first inning. Not sure what game you were watching. Given the Twins futility in NYC, it was all but in the bag. I’m saying the intensity wasn’t there.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
Wish I could have voted for...
You, for putting up this poll. A seeing eye blooper cost them the game. At some point in the season they’ll win one the same way.
That’s baseball folks.
can we start talking about tonight?
Jeter, Posada and Martin are sitting, with A-Rod DHing, Chavez and third and no one batting ninth. I mean, Molina’s in the lineup, but there’s no hitter in the ninth spot.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 3:36 PM EDT reply actions
Ooooh, thanks for telling me that Jeter is sitting today!
Gotta take him out of The Stolen Nachos lineup.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Nevermind.
LoL, damn early games.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
your trusted source for breaking lineup news
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Wish I knew early on.
I sat Ramirez today.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions
the only one who new earlier was Girardi's binder
And he’s not talking.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
What a prick.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
It sounds like a spring training game where half the veterans don't want to ride the bus.
Even though it’s home game. And there is no bus. If there were, we could throw Girardi under it. Why rest three starters inthe same game? Why do they need rest after 5 games in 6 days? Why do I state my opinions in the form of questions?
by designatedquitter on Apr 6, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm a little surprised about Jeter
I guess everyone’s getting tonight off because then the can all be used for four games in a row (tomorrow’s day game, two straight day games in Boston, then Sunday night) before the next off-day. Chavez needs to get into a game, and it makes sense to put him in against a right-hander. Martin’s played in every game, and now’s as good a time as ever. But sitting Jeter today does indicate that Girardi’s more serious about managing Jeter’s workload.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Mindless Use of the Bullpen!
I disagree with Joe even taking out C.C. in the first place (and my wife will vouch that I was yelling at the TV as Soriano was warming up so it’s not a second-guess :>)
*C.C. was dealing and had retired 17 in a row.
*The Yanks are in the middle of 8 straight games; the bullpen could have used an off day.
I’m not surprised though as this is how pitching is handled these days. Everyone has a role and they’re brought in whether it’s called for or not (and left in until they fail!).
You don't run your ace for 115-120 pitches in his second start of the year
He was already at 104. I know he’s CC and has more stamina than everyone else, but the Yankees need this guy healthy and fresh late in the season. Why would you try and push him for 8 in his second start with a 4 run lead and the best bullpen in the league?
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Thanks for the memories Andy
yes
In a tighter game, or a game where the bullpen was gassed, I could see sending Sabathia out for the eighth. But really, with our bullpen, there’s no excuse not to hold on to a six-run lead. Our relievers walked too many guys, and enough of their bloops fell in. Blame the relievers, or Girardi for not pulling Soriano, but he pulled CC at the right time.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Meh
I would have had CC start the 8th. He was cruising and was pitching particularly low-stress innings. (Not all innings are created equal!) If someone reached base, I’d have brought in either DRob or Soriano.
Mo pitched in 3 straight...
Jaba and Colon were unavailable, So threw a lot of pitches the day before, Feliciano is on DL, Yanks wer playing Sox in two days…I’ve got news for you, the bullpen was gassed.
by steelerwheeler on Apr 7, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
What Happened to Complete Games?
A sample of complete games by Yankee starting staffs over the last 40 years:
1970: 36
1980: 29
1990: 9
2010: 3
See a pattern?
You make expecting C.C. to pitch a complete game like asking him to donate a kidney! :>)
by Lord Shankley on Apr 6, 2011 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions
complete games don't happen that often any more
The Yankees didn’t invent the problem (if it is problem), and there’s no need for us to be the trend-setter.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
or at least not 9-inning complete games
I remember CC had a rain-shortened complete game last year (5 or 6 innings iirc)
I dunno, I kinda agree with him to a point.
I could be completely wrong here, but I swear players are pampered more and are getting injured more as well.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think the move away from complete games and "pampering" players is just in the MLB
They’ve been doing the same thing at the Little League, college, and (I suspect) high school levels to protect arms. And you have to admit, baseball pitching is one of the more grueling physical activities that we do since the motion is unnatural.
At a certain point, however, major league players should be able to handle 100 or more pitches per outing.
I agree, but I swear it seems like players are actually getting injured even more now.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Could it be "Creeping LaRussaism"?
All I’m trying to say is at some point when you have a bullpen full of specialists it’s mighty hard not to use them every day.
I put this on Tony LaRussa with the A’s in the 1990’s. It’s when games started to last almost 4 hours also.
by Lord Shankley on Apr 6, 2011 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions
maybe it is a problem, maybe it isn't
I’m not that eager for the Yankees to lead the charge to fix things.
by long time listener on Apr 6, 2011 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh NICE!
Yahoo Fantasy finally added OF to Martin Prado’s roles. Very nice!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Apr 6, 2011 3:43 PM EDT reply actions
The leadoff
walk to Span in the 10th pissed me off, but he does have a small strike zone. Not getting a runner past first after the second inning is a bit absurd. Once the Twins tied the game I simply felt there was no way the Yanks would win, if only because that would’ve been the proper ending to the way the game unfolded. After the twins tied it the Yanks jumped on everything Capps and Nathan threw. Even assuming they were pitches in the strike zone, why not try to take a pitch or get into a favorable count. Neither of those 2 relievers is so imposing that you fear getting to two strikes with them (Posada swinging at 2-1 against Valverde on Sunday is understandable for this reason).
wasn't it 3-1, down 2 with just one runner on?
It’s like Yogi said, 90% of half of the catchers are dumb. Too many hits to the head, they’re like boxers and lineman. Dumb as a box of rocks
by steelerwheeler on Apr 7, 2011 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Girardi blew it!
How about caling out Girardi for pulling Sabathia? THe guy was pitching a shutout and had only thrown 100 pitches.
by RJ the yankee fan on Apr 6, 2011 6:07 PM EDT reply actions
exactly
Unless there is something that I don’t know, pulling Sabathia in the first place was the mistake, not the choice of relievers. CC is a horse, he does not need a 100 pitch count. If he is rolling like that, let him pitch at least through the 8th inning.
I don't care about Soriano leaving
but putting your fourth best reliever in during the most crucial moment of the young season so far was inexcuseable
Formerly known as Brian5517209
What about pulling D-Rob
I know you gotta use your closer when tied in extras at home, but Yanks weren’t looking like they’d score any-time soon. Pulling D-Rob guaranteed a Boone Logon and/or Ayala sighting in the 10th :(
I vote for ESPN, for picking the Sux to win it all
So far, liking the way this season’s going
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