2012 Yankees Thoughts: Pitching
by Travis G on Oct 10, 2011 1:00 PM EDT
in New York Yankees Analysis
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PrintThis is not necessarily what I believe will happen, but what I would do as GM of the Bombers.
- We just have to hope CC doesn't opt out. If he does, then there's not much choice but to give him (nearly) what he wants. There might not be a more valuable Yankee.
- Go all out for Yu Darvish (assuming he's posted). He's better than Daisuke, will cost nothing in terms of draft picks, and is still young. The club could really use a true (potential) No. 2 behind the big guy. The 25-year-old righty has a 92-38 record over seven seasons in Japan with a 2.01 ERA. He's also coming off a career year: 17 wins (in a 140-game season where starters only go once a week) and a 1.49 ERA with a ridiculous .843 WHIP and 7.5 K/BB.
- If that doesn't happen, make a serious run at C.J. Wilson. He'll be 31, but he's lefty and only has minor wear-and-tear on his arm, having started for just two seasons now. He also has excellent numbers against AL East opponents.
- Give Phil Hughes another chance at starting. It's too early to give up on him in that role yet, but his clock is ticking. He has the potential to be an excellent starter for years to come. But if he struggles with success or health again, a permanent move to the bullpen might be in his and the team's best interests. (I can't recall a pitcher with a such a drastic drop in velocity from one inning to the next.) For some reason, he hasn't shown the ability to maintain velocity through a whole game.
- Groom David Robertson to succeed Mo. I believe, even if Mo has another Mo-type year, that 2012 will be his last. He seems like the kind of guy that's proud enough to want to go out on his own terms, not when he can't play anymore. And with buddy Jorge Posada presumably gone, there'll be one less reason for him to stay. But I do foresee him staying with the club in some capacity.
- Let Dellin Betances and Manny Banuelos spend a full year at Triple-A. Their control and offspeed pitches still need work. And we don't want a repeat of Joba '07, who came up and was so good as a reliever that some had trouble seeing him in any other role. They also have a handful of solid pitchers who already spent significant time in Triple-A/MLB (Adam Warren, David Phelps, and a little-used guy called Hector Noesi).
- Make Andrew Brackman a reliever. If he didn't have a ML deal, this would be different, but he does, and he has to stick on the Yankees roster by 2013. He was atrocious as a starter in Triple-A this year. After a late season conversion to the pen, he was a completely different pitcher. If he's doing well at midseason, and there's a need at the big league level, promote him.
- Let Joba take his time back. The former phenom will probably return sometime next year from Tommy John Surgery. But Joba and the Yanks should take their time. The bullpen was excellent this year, and might be even better next. We want Joba for the long term. That means not rushing him.
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I agree with most of this except for 2 points. I would keep Hughes in the pen as a long reliever and then to be the setup man for Robertson as he converts to being the closer, if, in fact, that happens. The other thing I disagree with, in part, is going after Darvish. IF he can be had cheaply, and he won’t be, then perhaps I’d go after him. And even if we do sign him, I would still go after a PROVEN starter, a lefty preferably. If we signed Darvish and he fails, we’re right back where we started, and worse. I don’t see how you even attempt to presume he’d be as good as a number 2 Major Leaguer when he’s only pitched in Japan. Quite a stretch.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Major league scouts who have seen him say he will be an immediate superstar in MLB. You don’t have a 1.5 ERA against AAAA quality hitters if you aren’t good. Even if his ERA doubles when he comes here, it would still be in the 3s.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
I believe, even if Mo has another Mo-type year, that 2012 will be his last. He seems like the kind of guy that’s proud enough to want to go out on his own terms, not when he can’t play anymore.
Mo said he can pitch till he’s 50. I say let him.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 1:29 PM EDT reply actions
I’ve been thinking about the posting fee for Darvish, and I think its going to be in the $55-65MM range, based on Dice-K’s posting fee and the Darvish is better than Dice-K. Add in inflation since then, too. Then he’ll probably get a 5 year, $60-70MM deal.
Would you allocate, potentially, $135MM for someone who has never thrown a pitch at the Major League level?
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 1:44 PM EDT reply actions
The only number that matters is the per year salary
1. The Yankees print money, so the posting fee doesn’t matter & won’t hurt us with the luxury tax.
2. Darvish is young enough that a 5 year deal covers the rest of his prime.
3. $14 million/year is less than AJ Burnett. CJ Wilson will at a minimum demand Burnett money.
I would be happy w. Darvish $15/year. As for the posting fee, Dice K was $51 million. I’m going to say the winning bid is $75.
by PortlandYankee on Oct 10, 2011 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions
1. The Yankees do not print money. The posting fee does matter. Just because it doesn’t hurt the luxury tax does not negate the fact that its an absurd amount of money.
2. I understand we’re getting a player in his prime. We wouldn’t be talking about him getting this kind of money if he wasn’t in his prime.
3. Why are Burnett or Wilson relevant?
Dice-K got six years, so you’d be okay with 6 years, and $90MM? And a $75MM posting fee? You do realize that’s now $165MM for a man who has never thrown a pitch at the Major League level, right?
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Why? What’s your logic behind that?
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Couple of reasons
1) If they really wanted to, the NYY could run out a $300 million payroll & spend the same amount relative to other teams; their revenue stream is just that high. I get the sense they don’t do that to avoid a hard salary cap. So I have no problem with a 1-time expenditure of $50-75 million.
2) Looking down the road, I am not confident that there is any pitcher who will hit FA who is as good & young as Darvish for the price. My guess is that Wilson will demand 18/per, and he’s 31. Matt Cain & Cole Hamels may want $20/per, and 6 or 7 years that take them into decline, even if they aren’t extended.
3) I don’t see anyone coming up in our system who has top of the rotation stuff.
4) There is no other part of the team that we can invest in for the immediate future that will bring back the returns of a real #2. The only argument for not pursuing Darvish is if we think that $15 million can be rolled into improving RF in a year (Kemp), or making a trade for a SS/3B (moving Jeter to 3B & A-Rod to DH).
by PortlandYankee on Oct 10, 2011 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Well
3. Ever hear of Manny Banuelos?
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I would have to look at ManBan’s ranking compared to other guys who came out like Moore, Hellickson, Price, and even Hughes to see where I really think he falls.
My understanding is that he profiles to be no higher than a #2 right now, and has struggled making the adjustment to AAA.
Obviously, he’s only going to be 20 next year, yes, so a curve is expected. But now we’re talking about at least 1 full season until he’s ready, if he does adjust.
by PortlandYankee on Oct 10, 2011 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Ranking?
Rankings give only general impressions. The game is littered with guys who projected to be #1’s. I’ve seen Manny pitch twice. The first time he struggled with command early and didn’t get through 5 innings. The second time out against a much better offense, he was crisp, and demonstrated to me he was learning how to pitch. He’s got a nice easy delivery with great movement.
In the past, I’ve been really high on Kennedy and Nova. Neither projected to be much — certainly not ones or even #2’s. But they are winners and frankly that’s all that counts.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
Lots of good points in this post PY
But I’d agree that ManBan may be top of the line stuff
Bring lawyers, guns and money to get me out of this one! Stand in the Fire.
Agreed
with 1 and 2. Though Wilson will probably get upwards of $20M/season. He’s a LHP coming off a great year in a hitter’s ballpark.
3. Betances has ace-type stuff, but has to command it well enough to reach that ceiling.
4. I do think Wilson would be a no.2, but Darvish is younger and wouldn’t require forfeiting a draft pick.
Betances reminds me of AJ a bit
Terrific stuff, but inconsistent and wild. AJ has never been able to harness and command his stuff consistently enough, and thats why he’s never really been an ace. Hopefully Betances becomes really good in due time.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
Source?
the NYY could run out a $300 million payroll & spend the same amount relative to other teams; their revenue stream is just that high
The Yankees have a lot of revenue streams (ticket sales, concessions, YES network, etc) but they just built a large new expensive stadium and their payroll numbers are clearly the highest in baseball. Under the “one time expense” theory it’s clear they could be outbid. Ted Lerner of the Nationals, for example, could buy out the Steinbrenners lock, stock, and barrel and tuck them into a part of his net worth. It’s not a question of “can they be out bid” it’s a question of “will they be outbid.”
That’s true, but it would also take the Nationals owner a lot longer to make that money back because his team just doesn’t pull in the same revenues as the Yankees.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
They don't have the same expenses, either
And his revenues have a lot of room for expansion on the fan side, and making the team relevant would potentially help do just that. Even with Strasburg hurt most of the year their attendance was up, but the Nationals have about 17,000 seats per game available. The Yankees don’t. The Nationals play in the #8 media market in the country but right now their media impact is small; putting a winning team on the field could really move them up. They also have a much more favorable stadium deal than the Yankees.
It’s the “pay money to make money” philosophy that the Yankees have done for years. Some other team might think that’s a good model to emulate. I’m completely agnostic on whether anyone should invest that much money in Yu Darvish (there have been a lot of sure things in the past that didn’t pan out; at least drafting them doesn’t cost quite so much money). But someone will, and it might not be the Yankees.
Here are the most recent numbers, and my walk back
In 2010, Yankee revenue was $441 million, and $416 was spent on baseball operations (I don’t know what goes into operations besides payroll). This is in line with what other clubs spend relative to their revenues.
Most likely, a Darvish posting fee would hurt the Yankees for a few years, which they could make back from marketing him in Japan.
by PortlandYankee on Oct 10, 2011 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
And how much bonus would that be for the Yankees,
Who already have Japanese fans from the Matsui signing.
Perhaps; Americans tend to "root for the laundry" as they say
But even if the Japanese only root for the Japanese, my other point stands – other teams can also market in Japan, so that’s a null factor in terms of who can afford Darvish.
A Plan
Its not gonna be for $165 mil I’d be surprised if the posting fee is over $50 mil to be honest and they’ll probably sign Darvish for 5 years around 10-12 per Hes definitely not going to be earning 15 mil a year . If I were the Yanks Id not trade Montero for anyone except Felix Hernandez and the idea of them trading him for guys like Shields is just plain ridiculous. Id also focus on resigning Alfredo Aceves I was real confused when they let him go last year especially for what he wound up signing for. They swallow these multi million dollar mistakes and they wouldn’t take a risk on that guy for under a mil just didnt make any sense to me. If CC opts out let him walk and go hard after CJ Wilson he’ll be less money he’s younger and we dont want another albatross Arod in resigning CC contract do we …..
It is risky, but keep in mind that the posting fee won’t count against the luxury tax. His actual yearly salary won’t be very high. Plus, you gain a lot of revenue from Japanese markets, because Darvish is like a rock star over there.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
Just because it doesn’t count against the luxury tax doesn’t mean it isn’t a lot of money. It’s still a massive amount of money. Even the Yankees have their limits.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
We would make that money back and more with the increased revenue from Japanese markets.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
Well, when Matsui was a Yankee
I saw his billboard all over Tokyo when I was there. Mind you, I don’t know if the Yankees get any money from that, but there’s that possibility
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Jersey sales, Japanese media, Japanese ppl jumping on the wagon, etc. Trust me i’ve been to Japan and they love their Japanese players and their sports channel shows highlight only of those players rather than full game.
by lololol on Oct 10, 2011 2:59 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I've been in the locker room in 09
Matsui sat on the bench some days and the Japanese media were still surrounding him like he hit the game winning HR.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Well like lololol said
They love their players that come over to play the honorable game of baseball here in the states. They have to have the rights to show footage from YES, so I’m pretty sure that money is involved there. Plus advertisements in Japan, jersey sales, perhaps more Japanese fans coming to the game to see him pitch which is a definite possibility here in NYC.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
didn't they have Japanese signs on the outfield wall when Matsui was here?
I don’t remember seeing those signs since he left.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmmmm, good point
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
That was a Japanese Newspaper company, the largest in the world with a circulation of about 14 mil. They paid about $800,000 for the signage.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
how many other players are worth $800,000 (minimum) per year by themselves?
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow
$800k for a few seasons really takes a bite out of the $50 million posting fee
Not
by NYYankeeDude on Oct 10, 2011 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Supposedly the Mariners get a lot of revenue from Japanese TV because of Ichiro
So, I guess the same could hold true for Darvish
darvish has one japanese parent and one iranian parent (dad, IIRC)
this is another factor in his “rockstar” image—and one more reason some give that he might have what it takes to be a wiiner in the bigs (not necessarily in agreement on this point, personally)… fwiw, i can confirm that coverage of MLB in japan is HIGHLY focussed on teams with japanese players: i’ve had a hard time finding coverage here of yankees games (since matsui left), while the red sox still get theirs (yes, it sucks)… i definitely agree that a darvish signing will pay dividends in terms of both revenue and strengthening the yankee “brand”. (been living in japan for most of the past 15 years, and i also think going fairly hard after darvish is, at the very least, not particularly foolish…)
by sing_or_die_1818 on Oct 10, 2011 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions
There's no doubt about this
I was in Japan for the end of the ‘09 WS, and Matsui’s face was constantly on TV the day after it ended.
Usqueadbaugham! Anam muck an dhoul ! Did ye drink me doornail?
IIRC
Foreign MLB merchandise sales are split among all 30 teams. But as for TV rights, domestic merchandise, ad revenue, I would assume it all goes to the Yanks.
Not just foreign
ALL sales of MLB licensed merchandise is equally split. It’s why I asked the question of how signing Darvish will somehow be paid for???
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Dice-K's posting fee of $51 million blew away the previous high
I’m not sure we won’t see another “blown away” number with Darvish. Especially with the desperation of certain teams (ahem, Yankees) and the fact that the bids are sealed.
I agree with getting Wilson or Darvish
We’re sure to wind up over-paying for whoever we get, but they both should be sold middle-of-the-rotation guys, which is what we need. And they’re likely to be worth it for two or three years, after which time AJ should be gone and (hopefully) at least one of Betances or Banuelos will be ready to step in as No. 2-ish type – plus, at least one of Warren, Phelps or Noesi will be a sold starter for us, too.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 1:44 PM EDT reply actions
I'd go for both
What the hell – everyone hates th NYY anyway – spend the $$
Possible in 2013
CC
Darvish
Wilson
Hughes
Betances or Banuelos
Of course, that did not do it for Philly this year
Bring lawyers, guns and money to get me out of this one! Stand in the Fire.
Did AJ die?
He’s under contract through 2013.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
I really don't see pitching as a major concern
With our makeshift rotation, we had the best record in the AL this season. Even without Fatty Colon, they could technically resign Garcia and we’d still have the same rotation as last year, just with Hughes instead of Tubs McEatsalot. Again, I also think Hughes is going to have a bounce back year next year. Also, we have a few rookies who could possibly be groomed into starters as well. After the success Nova had, I’m willing to give our farm some more chances.
This is why the thought of trading Montero for a starter is laughable and downright stupid. We got to the playoffs without a 2nd ace or a “#2” starter, and we did not lose the ALDS due to said lack of 2nd ace or “#2” starter. We lost because of our offense, you know the thing Montero is supposedly really good at. So yeah, if the Yankees want to spend dat Yankee cash on a Wilson or Darvish, fine. If we get them, I hope they work out. If not, I’ll still be confident in what we have. All I know is that the Phillies came into the postseason with the best record and best rotation in baseball and still lost with 2 aces & and #2.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 1:49 PM EDT reply actions
I'd bring him back even as a long relief man
What he originally was until Hughes’ dead arm.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I find Garcia the most fun to watch after CC. When he’s on, even more than CC.
"Have faith in the Yankees my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
Pinstripe Alley | The Hometown Fan | @jscape2000
I personally find Nova the most fun Yankees pitcher to watch
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree, though when CC is on it’s amazing.
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Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Oh most certainly
But rookies are exciting, especially one like Nova! It reminds me of when Andy Pettitte first came up.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
He reminds me a bit more of Wang.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Wang was definitely exciting!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Uhhhh
The pitcher, right?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
I mean seriously!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
we'd be taking a bit of a risk with Garcia
He’ll be another year older, and it seemed like he faded a bit down the stretch (I may be making that up; I’ll eat crow if someone shows that his numbers weren’t noticeably worse in September). I have no problem using the money we’ll save on Jorge’s contract on another starter.
I also wish I could be as optimistic about Hughes having a bounce-back year.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not sure how much risk is really involved, though
Especially if they can roll out another low-end contract. Unfortunately, this () is a good argument for the theory that he will get around $5 million on his next contract. Still, I don’t know that that figure is necessarily above “low-end.” He’s certainly serviceable as a fifth starter. Is he capable of duplicating his success this year? Possibly not, but even if his stats regressed to those he posted in 2010, that’s still not awful for a 5th starter.
I'd be all for giving one of the three you mentioned a shot
And keeping Garcia in a long relief role, just like last year. If one of them falter, then put him back in the rotation again.
As for Hughes, I just feel that logically the Yankees pitching staff is going to focus a lot on him and work with him during the offseason. There are times he still shows signs of potential, and I’d hate to see that wasted.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not ready to give up on him
I’m just not ready to count on him being a steady contributor next year.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Trust me, I'm a Yankees fan
Plus, I was right about the Red Sox rotation this year. Huh? Huh!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's some evidence to help you
Pre all star break ERA: 3.13, BAA: .259
Post: 4.45, BAA: .283
September ERA 7.36
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Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
that post-ASB performance isn't very good
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you could easily make the case that at times, the Yankees had three “number two” pitchers, but they never clicked at the same time. Colon was nasty in the beginning, then it was Freddy who turned in quality outings, and then Nova.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions
it'd be great to have one guy do that all year
Then have a number of guys who can contribute as No. 3s.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Kinda like posting here on PSA
Some aces, then a lot of #3’s, then a huge amount of mops!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm an ace
…right?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Of course!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Fantastic!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Well this is why I find the whole concept of a #2 starter to be a bit silly
All I really want is good pitching, whether a #2 or #3 or whatever. During the last bit of the year, did CC look like an ace or a #2?
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with, too
The numbers don’t mean too much. I want someone who’s going to pitch over 200 innings and earn around a 3.00 to 3.5 ERA. That’s No. 2-ish.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
I feel like 200 IP of 3.00 ERA ball is pretty ace like.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I think under 3 is a pure ace
But again, there’s no need to split hairs with the numbers
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions
We should just split nachos with the numbers!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Same here
We should get some during the World Series
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions
PSA Meetup!
When’s the WS start? I’ve too depressed to actually look at the schedule.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions
*been
And too depressed to include verbs with my sentences.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I think next week sometime
But yeah, Game 1 Nachos! It’s on! Well, unless it’s a Saturday, cause I’ll most likely be working!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 11, 2011 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Man, that's fast.
Well, I’m down if you are!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 11, 2011 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I could do some quick nachos on a Wednesday
Or game 2 on thursday.
by long time listener on Oct 11, 2011 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
So CC isn't a pure ace?
Because usually he’s right around a 3 ERA or a little higher. He seems like a pure ace to me.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
Other things to think about
CC is operating in a really ugly run environment (YS, AL East).
Really, an “ace” is a top-echelon pitcher, measured by ERA or WAR or something else.
CC is an ace.
by PortlandYankee on Oct 10, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
really? AJ Burnett had a 4.04 ERA in 2009, yet we considered him a #2.
At least at the time, when he was going against guys like Pedro Martinez and Josh Beckett.
The run environment is 2011 is different than it was in 2009. A 4.04 ERA in 2009 =/= a 4.04 ERA in 2011.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 11, 2011 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
With Hughes
I wonder if his workout regiment needs to be adjusted. He’s gained considerable weight over the last couple years. I wonder if his conditioning is affecting his ability to maintain velocity during his starts.
We need to try for at least 1 of Darvish or Wilson
I wouldn’t count on a Garcia/Colon experiment working again.
So I agree with all these points.
Agreed. I would rather have Darvish because he’s like 7 years younger and has like 5 more years of experience as a starter.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
And he's probably better too
Certainly has better stuff.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
Would anyone be interested in a Yu Darvish “Baseball Courtroom?”
I would need two debaters, first come, first serve (one for, one against) and a jury of four community members. I’ll be the fifth. Jury members would also be first come, first serve.
OR
Send me your debate (either for or against) and I’ll pick the best ones to be featured in the courtroom.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:16 PM EDT reply actions
You’ve already heard my side. Besides, there is no debating the issue here. People care not to spend other people’s money and most here want him signed. The Jury Pool will be tainted.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Well, it’s the jury’s duty to choose a winner based on the presentation of the debate, not their opinions.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s hard to escape bias but I would just have to ask the potential jury members to evaluate the debates, not the topics.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Sadly
from what I saw in the past, clearly people here voted for their “favorite guy” over who actually made a decent and valid point. And besides that, minds are already made up.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Maybe then the for and against people should be anonymous until the vote?
Maybe they already are, and I’m forgetting?
You can find my email on my profile page or by clicking the little envelope next to my name under the “Writers” section at the bottom of the page.
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Woah stealing my idea. We have to have a talk! Haha, I’ll be a jury member because I really don’t know yet.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
That’s kind of why I want to do it. So I get a better idea on it. And wasn’t that someone else’s idea to begin with? Gelatin?
Contributing writer for Pinstripe Alley.
by Frank Campagnola on Oct 10, 2011 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, his idea with me as a founding partner, then he told me to take over. I’m kidding around, it’s a good idea, I’d like to be in the jury.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
I'd kind of like to debate it
Though my side is well known, and I’ve already done one of the courtroom things so someone else can do it if they want.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
How about no.
Jesus Montero fangirl
by WhatwouldJeterdo on Oct 10, 2011 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
you'll need a master too
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
I only want Garcia/Colon back on minor league deals, and if Colon gets a MILB deal it should be for long relief.
I agree with everything you said Travis, especially that we need to give Hughes another chance. Not sure about Darvish yet.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Also, not big on Wilson.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
Neither am I
But I think we can agree that they need somebody legitimate to be in the rotation next year, and basically your three choices are Darvish, Wilson, or looking for a trade. Looking for a trade involves getting rid of Montero, so that is out for me. And if they fail to get Yu Darvish, then I think Wilson (while I’m not a fan of it) may be the best option.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
Pitching stats from their last years in Japan:
Hideo Nomo: 8-7, 3.63 era, 126 K
Kei Igawa: 14-9, 2.97 era, 194 K
Kaz Sasaki: 1.93 era, 19 saves
Daisuke Matsuzaka: 17-5, 2.13 era, 200 K
Yu Darvish: 17-6, 1.49 era, 261 K
I think it’s clear which pitcher is far and away the greatest.
Home of the Jared Jeffries Shot Tracker
Nomo?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer/Editor for Pinstripe Alley, Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
By far
Every single scout says that if signed he’d be the #1 starter on a lot of teams and could be an immediate superstar.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
pitching let us down also
We lost three close games. Yes you can argue that with better offense we win at least one of those games. But then again with a little better starting pitching we give up one or two less runs and win one of those games also. Did Detroit win those 3 close games because their offense was better than ours or because their pitching was better? We need better pitching. Our offense is more than good enough, though I agree we need Montero’s bat and maybe replace Swisher in right. I miss Paul O’Neal’s clutch hitting.
by yankeefan4ever2 on Oct 10, 2011 3:51 PM EDT reply actions
when you lose a couple of one-run games, and one two-run game
It can go either way. If our pitching had given up a couple of fewer runs, we would be on our way to Texas for Game 3. Same thing if we got one clutch hit.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Be Creative
Trade Arod for B Zito and eat 50 million. I beleive he hurts us in plenty of ways. I do not know Zito’s whole contract. Zito can be a lefty RP. 2 years left at around 20M.
Then we can shift Jter to 3B and Maybe sign Reyes. With some creativity we need to work Arod out!.
that's creative, all right
It’s also unrealistic.
by long time listener on Oct 10, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I certainly wouldn't have thought of it
That’s for sure!
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I admit crazy creative
However, if a team said you would eat 80 million of the remaining 143 million on Arod contract of the deal right now would you do it?
So we pay basically we actually save 63 million over 6 years which is 10 illion a year. I think we can do better finding a quality contributor for 10 million a year without locking down a DH spot.
I agree with pretty much everything Travis
Though I’ve already said everything about Darvish and made a fanpost about it, I’ll say it again. He won’t cost picks, his contract won’t be too huge, he’s young, and he’d solidify the rotation and possibly be a second ace. Even if his ERA doubles from what it was in Japan, he’s still one of the top starters on the team. Every single scout and GM believes he will be successful if not a superstar in the major leagues. I think that not going after him would be foolish.
If they don’t get him (but if they truly want him, then they will get him), then yes, make a run at CJ Wilson or possibly Edwin Jackson. I’m not a huge fan of either, but they need another starting pitcher and Wilson is the only other legitimate guy available. Are there players they could go for in a trade? Yes, but I’m seriously scared that Jesus Montero would be the centerpiece to be traded in a trade for any legitimate starting pitcher, and since there are two very good ones on the market, not going hard after them would be ridiculous.
What’s your stance on the rest of the bullpen though? Because right now I think only Rivera, Robertson and Logan are locked up and a sure thing to be in the pen to start next year. I know that Soriano will almost certainly be back as well, but there’s still questions about who to get and/or who to let go. Ayala I never want to see in pinstripes again. As for Cory Wade, I’d look at resigning him seeing as he did an unbelievably good job this season. And there’s still questions about Joba’s health, what to do with Noesi and possibly what to do with Damaso Marte also. Definitely a lot of pitching news for this team to keep us occupied this winter.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
His contract won’t be “too” huge? There will be a $65-$75 MILLION dollar posting fee….
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
I think it's all a moot point anyway
For some reason I don’t think the Yankees will pursue him aggressively and he’ll sign elsewhere. Somewhere out West.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Posting fee doesn't count toward the luxury tax
The Yankees make a ton of money, and any money they have to pay in the posting fee will be paid off by the money they will get from Japan if Darvish is signed.
I don’t care about the posting fee. At all. I care that they would be bringing a top flight pitcher to the Yankees who would help them win a championship.
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
It's still money
You don’t care about the posting fee. Funny. The Yankees might. He is top flight in Japan. It’s a HUGE risk I hope they don’t take.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
You really have a low opinion of Japanese hitters
It’s AAAA ball. Thats what pretty much everyone says about it. If you had a guy with an ERA of under 2 for four straight seasons in AAA would you want him in the majors or not? Yes, it’s a lot of money. It’s also a huge upside. EVERY scout in the majors thinks he will be a superstar in the league. I don’t look at that as a huge risk that you are hoping will work out right. I look at it as a wise investment because I expect him to turn out right. Are you expecting Darvish to fail because he’s from Japan?
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
I never said I “expect him to fail” and what does from where he comes have to do with anything? He’s faced inferior talent and I wouldn’t pay him the money it is going to take when he’s never faced a major league hitter. It’s not hard to understand.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
And we should have pursued Yoon of Korea. He blew away Venezuela. And that was a hell of a lineup. But hey, let’s not talk sample sizes either, as many of you like to do when there is no other way to win their argument. Lol. I really don’t care if they want to pursue Darvish, I just hope they sign an established pitcher also. Surely they wouldn’t sign him and be dependent on him succeeding.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Right
That’s how one should think of it. If we had a minor leaguer putting up the stats Darvish is, we’d be screaming for him to be promoted (e.g. look at Jesus this year despite having merely a nice season), and NPB is said to be better than AAA, so… there you go. Obviously the money is a factor, but if he brings back $11M/year (like in the linked article below), it’ll make his deal a lot more palatable.
Re: Bullpen
Soriano is also a lock unless he opts out (which would be incredibly stupid). After that are a lot of ?s. Do Marte, Feliciano or Joba contribute? What happens to Noesi? Warren, Phelps and Brackman could also be significant additions. I’m just not worried about the pen (nice when Mo is around to anchor it), because there are plenty of options.
Baring no changes to the pen and getting rid of Mitre, Proctor, and Laffey
The Yankees still have the strongest bullpen in the majors.
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Typo. No edit button
"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"
by I'mGivingYouARaise on Oct 10, 2011 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting link when Redsox were in same position with Dice K
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/how-much-is-matsuzaka-worth/
sorry I do not know how to link it properly.
He wasn't nearly as good as Darvish is
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
yup
Let us all congratulate the Boston Red Sox for becoming the first World Champions in the history of sports to NOT make the postseason! Thats not easy to do!
Like I’ve said before, comparing Matzuzaka to Darvish is like comparing CJ Wilson this year to 1999 Pedro Martinez.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
The guy is already considered the greatest pitcher in the history of the Japanese leagues, and he’s only 25. He’s more proven than Strasburg, but I bet you wouldn’t mind having that guy.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
Strasburg is a lot, and I mean a LOT, cheaper than Darvish
Strasburg signed for 4 years, $15.1 million total. It will cost four times that much to talk to Darvish.
And Adrolis chapman?
he faced like A ball talent. he got around 60 mil total simply for having a 100+ mph fastball despite having no refined secondary pitches. While Darvish is far more polished.
And that was a dumb signing, too. But, I do think the talent pool he faced is better than what one would face in Japan. I still wonder why the Yankees never pursued him, though.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
If you really view the Japanese talent that low, then there’s a problem. It seems you have a biased against the Japan’s leagues for whatever reason and have a unrealistically low view of their talent.
Not at all
I’m averse to giving ANYBODY that kind of a contract without having ever thrown one pitch in the majors.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Sometime you take a risk if the talent is that high
Plus the contract itself wouldn’t be absurd, it is actually quite reasonable. The posting is another story but there are ways it can be made up as mentioned before.
I think david just doesn't like Charlie
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
Haven't the Yanks been burned by enough Japanese pitchers?
by upstateNYYFan1984 on Oct 10, 2011 5:01 PM EDT reply actions
So because Jose Contreras didn’t work out, we should avoid Dominican pitchers too, right?
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
My point is that it’s foolish to disregard an entire country of players just because a couple from there haven’t worked out.
The Savior has come, and he is glorious. #63
I agree
But I wouldn’t give that kind of money to ANY unproven commodity. If anything, maybe 1st round draft pick kind of money.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Difference, The DR has produced hall of fame pitchers.
Japan has not. They all burn out in a few years. Only Nomo had a halfway decent career, and he was a 4-5 guy after he left the Dodgers. Even Okijima has fizzled after a couple really good years with Boston, and he’s a reliever. Pitchers from Japan just never hold up over a whole contract.
by upstateNYYFan1984 on Oct 10, 2011 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions
agreed
El Duque was major player for our World Series Rings…and Contreras had a decent career once he left NY. But Japan pitchers…just don’t hold up, and in my opinion, are not worth the bid, or contract, they would require.
Small Sample Size
Except for Murikami in the 60s there have only been Japanese players in the MLB since about 1995, only about 30 of whom have been pitchers. And none of those players have been as good as Darvish has been in Japan.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
Igawa was the only one they got burned by in the posting process
And that was to the tune of $5 mil/year I think. Irabu was a trade, not a posting. For that matter, they got Alfonso Soriano from Japan, and he didn’t turn out too badly.
We should avoid caucasin pitchers
Look at how Burnett, Wright, Pavano, and Johnson turned out. Enough of the whites.
i highly doubt the Yankees will get CJ Wilson
Darvish seems like the only option of the two. i believe that both ManBan and Betances should have a full year in AAA and then see where they are from that. i’m not entire opposed to trading Betances because while he has strikeout stuff, he walks too many batters and is getting old for a prospect. ManBan still has a couple young years in front of him, he will hopefully be a starting pitcher for the Yankees by 2013
I'd like to thank the good Lord for making me a Yankee fan.
People seem to forget that in Dice-K's first season (only one where he was fully healthy)
He wasn’t terrible. 200innings+ 4.40 era 4.23 FIP 4.17 xFIP 3.9 fWAR.
Next year he posted 3.3 WAR in only 167 innings.
Darvish is expected to be a level ahead of Dice-K so he potentially exceed 4 -5 WAR…
Yes Dice-K sucks now, but for two years he looked he might be worth the money before injuries.
I would hope not
Rec Generating Database
Jedi Master A-Rod is a poster on Pinstripe Alley. He can be reached by clicking the "Reply" button below his comments.
by Jedi Master A-Rod on Oct 10, 2011 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Yankswill get Pitching this Winter
We sign either Darvish or Wilson. Only one of the two.
Then we add some depth from one of this list below:
Buerhle
J Francis
R Harden
E Jackson
H Kuroda
Me thinks CC walks
Would not be shocked to see CC go west coast and NL. He got his ring and would do much better in NL and can use his stick to boot. If SF or LA can afford him, I think he goes. I say we got his best years so I’m probably in the minority when it comes to not throwing $ and years at him and begging him to stay. The Yankees have turned into the Braves to some extent – built for the regular season but not the short series. As much as the Yanks have thrown at their #1s – none of them have been #1s in the post season – of course the Phillies are out with two #1s so need more than a stud – I would trade Montrero in a package for Felix. Montrero may end up being good but he will NOT be Pujols or anywhere near that class – I will take King Felix at his age for next 7 years. Nova and/or Hughes need to turn into this Yankee’s version of Petitte – not sure either way can do it – Nova had nice year but Hughes did a year ago so I’m not penciling in automatic progress – if he duplicates the 16-4 that would be a pleasant surprise but he could end up being a 15-10 type guy – he benefited from good run support just like Hughes the year prior. AJ is wild card but can’t unload so hopefully he can bottle whatever it is he drank in September and the Det game.
I'm with you too
If he opts out so be it. We are not the only ones watching him vs a Verlander or a Beckett feeling like an underdog.
I respect CC but I feel he does not have lights out talent vs big time line-ups.
If hestays I’m happy but do not want to sign him if he opts out.
And then who pitches for the Yankees?
CC is the only starting pitcher for the team I would be happy to trust with a do or die game. Every other SP we have is a question mark.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
Ya go out and get a decent starter either via trade or free agency and add him to Nova, AJ, Garcia, and Hughes or let one of the young’ens pitch.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
The only two free agency starters out there that are good enough (maybe) to replace CCs value
Are Darvish (maybe) or Wilson (maybe). Any pitcher on the trade market who could give us CC-like production would almost certainly cost Montero and/or the killer Bs. We can’t count on a Fister-like trade win or a Colon/Garcia trash heap find.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
Easier said than done dude…Halladay, Felix, Kershaw etc aren’t going on the market anytime soon. Plus the “youngins” no matter how good they can be are going to replace the production from CC…not even close. If Nova is our number one, there is a huge problem.
by lololol on Oct 10, 2011 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
We'll survive!
Gimme ManBan on the mound and Montero behind the plate and watch ’em blossom!
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
Or, let ManBan mature in AAA, and give him a better chance for MLB success
Rather than rush him into the spotlight, then wind up having the same fans who called for his promotion then turn around and call for his exile
I just don't want our rotation to be completely made of question marks
ManBan, Hughes, Burnett, Garcia, even Nova are all not the most solid guys. We need at least one (preferably two) guys to count on for solid pitching. One of those guys is CC and another should be Darvish or Wilson.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
Then give me Wilson
if those were the only options. But I still feel Cashman will pull off a deal for a solid starter.
"Unpleasant Internet Dude"
And give them who? Solid starters aren't cheap.
I’d rather keep our prospects and spend the money, especially since any deal for a proven guy who would be good enough to be our number two would start with Montero.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
The free agent market is great for the players. Teams and fans however don’t seem to do that well.
If CC opts out we should stand and wave goodbye.
by NYYankeeDude on Oct 10, 2011 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Its not like the yanks do not have 23 mil on the table for the next three years
all I’m saying if the 23 mill is not good enough thenso be it. We shoudl have not signed Arod after he opted out
Please. CC isn’t the only way the Yankees can win a world series. Look for example at the fact that none of the teams contending for the WS have CC and they’re, well, in the running and we’re not. So clearly CC is not the missing link there
by NYYankeeDude on Oct 10, 2011 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I was talking about A-Rod, actually
The OP said we should have let A-Rod walk. I pointed out that without A-Rod, the Yankees likely do not win in ’09. Nothing to do with CC.
Trades =if CC opts out
I would trade Montero for a Felix and then instantly sign the Prince and Wilson as my # 2 behind Felix. WIth Nova as a three.
The Yanks would have a King and a Prince and a princess in arod. Now that is Royalty
Montero for Felix?
Try Montero and another three players. MAYBE.
"Son, Nobody is half as good as Mickey Mantle"
You guys want Felix?
Give me Robinson Cano or NO DEAL!!
I am flagging every comment that mentions Felix from now on. The rest of your comment is also garbage.
by Briceratops on Oct 10, 2011 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Amazing
What amazes me is how easily fans spend the yankees money. 50 million for a bidding price…sure…it doesn’t count against the tax. Didn’t we learn our lesson w/ the winningest pitcher in AAA history….who can’t even sniff the yankee rotation. Don’t you think Boston would love to take back their Dice-K deal…he has been a major disappointment. CJ Wilson…..pass. Pitching is always the priority, but its not what let this team down this year. Bring back Garcia, AJ, CC, Nova, Hughes, and maybe someone from the pen gets a chance to start. Time to stop throwing top money at average starters or unproven commodities.
I hope CC does not opt out or if he does he is willing to take a salary bump and not demand more years. I would give him whatever he wants in terms of the money but the years would be a mistake. He is not going to be worth that money in his late thirties and should be paid at that time commiserate with his worth. Too many old players making superstar money. Not just on the Yankees. The madness has to stop.
agreed
Cashman was ready to let A-Rod walk, and the Brother’s stepped in to make sure we have an overpaid broken down superstar for years to come. If CC chooses to opt out, I agree, more money, but no more years. If he loves NY like he says, he will do what is best for the team, and not himself. If its more years, thank you CC for your leadership and World Series ring, good luck to you in the future…and lay off the captain crunch !
Years tend to be more important than money for some people
they want stability. CC probably doesn’t want to look for a new team in 3 years, so he’ll want somewhere where he can pitch til he decides to retire. If he opts out, it’s most likely he wants more year from us rather than more money in the short term
Didn't Brackman use new mechanics this year?
Make Andrew Brackman a reliever. If he didn’t have a ML deal, this would be different, but he does, and he has to stick on the Yankees roster by 2013. He was atrocious as a starter in Triple-A this year. After a late season conversion to the pen, he was a completely different pitcher. If he’s doing well at midseason, and there’s a need at the big league level, promote him.
I think he went back to his old mechanics once he went to the bullpen. I would rather have him try starting again with his old mechanics. He would only have the first to prove his worth starting with his old mechanics. Then I’d convert him to the bullpen.
I’m not fond of CJ Wilson at all. I’d pass on him if the Yankees don’t get Yu Darvish. I would prefer one year deals with Ryan Dempster, Hiroki Kuroda, Edwin Jackson, Mark Buehrle, Freddy Garcia, or Roy Oswalt. Some of these players have team options like Oswalt and Dempster. The Yankees just need a pitcher to make his starts at the end of the rotation.
CC
Why can’t we just extend CC another 3 years at same price? No one can pay him as much and it will give him the years back on the contract he is looking for. If he wants more then that you have to let him go. Also I’m not sold on CJ especially for what he is going to be looking for. Darvish is a 150 million mistake in the waiting. This might be one of those rare moments where the Yanks take a hit with middling guys that may or not pan out. Truth be told we have a lot of old money on the books and it is not going away anytime soon. Silly to suggest I know but is this the time when we actually are looking at a Yankees team that may be in a 2-3 rebuilding process? It’s not like the FA market helps us much this yeara considering our needs and availability.
Extend him another three years at the same price? That IS an albatross contract
Right now, if he doesn’t opt out, Sabathia’s contract runs another four seasons (2012-2015) at $24.286 million per season. He will be 35 at the end of that contract. You want to sign him for three more seasons, so he’ll be making nearly $50 million for seasons when he’s 37 and 38yo? That’s a long odds gamble, my friend.
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