The Tools of Ignorance: Thursday News
by jscape2000 on Jan 6, 2011 6:00 AM EST
in New York Yankees News
Email
PrintLet's try this Mood Music thingy: Early in the Morning, Buddy Holly
That doesn't seem so hard.
Things that matter:
Still waiting for Pettitte.
No point in discussing guys like Vlad, since the DH spot is firmly occupied by Jorge Posada. I don't really want to see too much of Jorge behind the plate in 2011.
Alomar and Blyleven are in the Hall. The gotta-get-ins still on the ballot for me are Tim Raines, Barry Larkin and Jeff Bagwell.
Ed Valentine doesn't think Pettitte is a Hall of Famer without another quality season or two. I don't think Pettitte will ever be a Hall of Famer.
I think Pettitte is the key to the Yankees' season, and if Pettitte doesn't return, Soriano is not the answer. Giving up a first round draft pick in what promises to be a rich draft class is not worth a brilliant 60 innings of work. Even less so for an expensive 60 innings. There can be no debate.
Back to things that don't matter: I'm reaching the bottom of my Netflix queue (5 stars for Scott Pilgrim vs the World- I'm a sucker for spectacle and NES references, though it wasn't really as good at The Children's Hour, the other 5 star movie of the new year).
Suggestions?
47 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Andy may not be a Hall of Famer
but he should be in the Yankees Hall of Fame.
He hasn’t had on losing year since he started in 1995.
CMON ANDY JUST ONE MORE YEAR! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he does I will buy a pair of Legends seats to one of his games! (of course not at face value and last minute purchase on stubhub)
Gardner for President.
I've never understood
how a setup man, no matter how brilliant, can be viewed as a replacement for not landing adequate starting pitching.
Seriously. Anyone care to explain what I’m missing?
It's just the knee jerk reaction...
Something happens, so something else MUST be done. Cliff Lee signs with Phillies, so the Yanks MUST sign Carl Crawford, etc.
Doesn’t make sense, but there you have it.
Makes no sense to me either.
Plus, his worst came against the O’s and Jays. I don’t want him and he’s not worth it.
There's always next year
Its not that they would replacing a starter with a setup man
They would be shortening the game to 7 innings because a lead with Soriano/Mo would be almost a guaranteed win. And this also would mean that you could use the youngsters and hope for 5 innings out of them and than two innings of pen work before double trouble come in.
Its funny that some find it prepostrous to pay a setup man big money because they are very important and Yankees fans should know, very hard to find. Without Wood last year, we probably miss the playoffs.
Should you choose to test my resolve in this matter, you will be facing a finality beyond your comprehension, and you will not be counting days, or months, or years, but milleniums in a place with no doors.
Am I the only one who remembers Mendoza, Rivera?
Not saying Soriano is the right move but that kind of end game was a hell of a lot of fun for the few years it was dominating.
I'm going to take a flyer and predict Cash finally satisfys his boner for Jarrod Washburn before seasons end. Anyone else wonder if Damons bed is one of those WWE ring with ropes sleeper? I'm looking for volunters to try out my new taser (only bandwagoners need apply).
by cashman bashman on Jan 8, 2011 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
Also, Blyleven...
His pitching record looks quite good. I’ll admit, I wasn’t sure if he belonged in the Hall, but was pleasantly surprised by the stats he posted. His 1973 season in particular was very impressive. (And a little before my time.)
Maybe his being shuffled around on five teams contributed to lack of enthusiasm for him in the Hall? Just speculating.
The one problem I’ve got with him — and it’s non-baseball — is for some reason, he comes across like an @ss to me. Have I formed a negative bias, or perhaps cherry-picked an unfortunate quote or two, or is he really a little bit too full of himself and/or rude and/or maybe not the sort of guy I would want to spend Christmas day (substitute comparable holiday of your choosing) with?
Wow and the press made it seem like he isnt worthy
The man threw 242 complete games. That stat alone is impressive and looking at his stats in the 1970’s leads me to think he was one of the best in that decade.
Gardner for President.
Blyleven
He’s worthy of his induction but I don’t think he should have been lobbying so hard for his induction.To me it seemed to lack a little bit of class. I think a player should just let everything playout and if you get inducted great, but if you aren’t, don’t let it consume you like it did Blyleven. Plus there may have been a reason it took you 14 years to get it.
i would have to agree
if you think you are hall-worthy, let your career speak for itself and let other people stump for you. That said, Bert did deserve to go IMO.
Blyleven never lobbied that hard for his induction.
It was started mostly by Rich Lederer, and carried on by much of the stats-oriented community. Because he deserved it.
The problem is that his career did speak for itself, but so many people ignored everything about his career in favor of “feelings” and “impact”.
I agree with Larkin, Raines, and Bagwell
not only were they great players but they were great players for a period of time and if not for Rickey Henderson, TIm Raines would be held in higher esteem. I think Larkin gets in next year and Bagwell will get in, in maybe 2 or 3. I’m not sure about Raines he deserves it but his vote total needs to start going up next year.
Best film of the year in my opinion
Should you choose to test my resolve in this matter, you will be facing a finality beyond your comprehension, and you will not be counting days, or months, or years, but milleniums in a place with no doors.
Saw it when it came out
I may have loved it. I haven’t decided yet.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
+1
It was fairly mind-blowing
March 31st can't come soon enough.
by Chris McKeown on Jan 7, 2011 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
The Bagwell thing bothers me
The guy had a .948 career OPS and a 149 career OPS+. He was a GREAT hitter for a long time. I have to believe that the only reason he received so few votes is that a good portion of the voters THINK he did steroids despite there being absolutely no evidence to the affirmative. This is really a bad precedent as its going to lead to guilty players getting in and innocent players being unfairly left out. The only solution is to just put everyone who’s deserving in, steroids or not. Just accept that it was a part of the game in that era and move on.
I’m not sure about Tim Raines. He was a hall of famer for the first half of his career but he was also just a role player for a long time. I think the voters are having trouble getting the post-1990 Tim Raines out of their heads.
Pettitte’s not a hall of famer any way you slice it. He’s undoubtedly a Yankee hall of famer, though I don’t believe his number should be retired. Outside of the 2nd and 3rd years of his career, Pettitte was never the ace of a staff, and I don’t think you can point to a year, outside of those two, where he was a top 10 starting pitcher in baseball.
by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Jan 6, 2011 2:15 PM EST reply actions
Pettitte and the draft ...
I wouldn’t say Andy is the key to our season, but he is an integral part of plans and not having him in the rotation would certainly put us in a bind (but remember, we have Kei Igawa). While I’m joking of course, there is an element of seriousness. For several years at least we’ve all heard and read about the Yankees vaunted A, AA, AAA pitching talent. I ask this: Where is that talent?
I certainly see it on other teams. The Giants, for example brought up some kids and they were nothing short of brilliant. Are the Yankee farmhands products of media and fan hype? I’m starting to think so.
As for the draft. I disagree that we shouldn’t give up a first round pick. What is this the NFL? We’re talking baseball draft — and yes, there is a HUGE difference. Baseball is littered with first round picks who are now selling cellphones at the local mall. I’ve heard draft experts say that after the first 10 picks it’s a crap shoot. We’re picking 31st! Are you feeling that lucky about our abilities to pluck a cherry? I’m not.
Go out and get Soriano and anyone else who can legitimately help our ballclub right now.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
I don't think it's fan/media hype
Because of the Yankees’ “win now” attitude, and the fact that the fans demand nothing short of a World Series title every season, they are shy to let a young guy fill out part of the rotation for fear he may not be lightning in a bottle. If he doesn’t show brilliance within 2 or 3 starts they seem to give up and try something else instead of letting the guy develop. Which is a short-sighted way of doing business and is ridiculous, imo. I think if we would let one or more of these youngsters actually go out and pitch and take their lumps one or more of them just may one day meet expectations.
There's always next year
Key to the Yankees
Andy would be a great addition to the rotation but he is not the “key to the Yankees season”. He’s a big piece, but I don’t like the way you worded that. It sort of feels like you are saying that if Andy retires, the Yanks have no shot next year. And I don’t think that is true. A lot of people use the word “key” (myself included) to some team, but the entire team is the key. One person is not the key to the entire team. The other 4 starters still have to produce. And I think that regardless of whether Andy comes back or not, the Yankees have a good shot next year.
That being said, I really hope Andy does come back. And I also think the Yankees should get Soriano. The “rich draft class” thing doesn’t scare me. The Yankees have a late pick because they were good last year, and in return for the “potential” of a possible pick they are getting for sure a lock down reliever that will make the Yankees bullpen one of the best in the league. I like draft picks too, but don’t overvalue them. “Potential” to be a great player and then actually being a great player are two different things. Those guys need to get there first. And I’m perfectly fine trading someone who might become a great player for someone who already is a great pitcher.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Please come back Andy!
I agree with most of this.
I do think that having a solid number three starter could be considered a “key” in the sense that it’s the difference between a high level of confidence in 3/5 rather than 2/5 of the games. Of course, Andy is very likely not going to pitch anywhere near 20% of the games, so his contribution might make the split more like 50-50.
Usqueadbaugham! Anam muck an dhoul ! Did ye drink me doornail?
Andy has HOF numbers
There are very few pitchers with 100+ more wins than losses and every one of them is on HOF except Mike Mussina who is not eligible for the HOF yet. I don’t remember which pitchers are on this exclusive list but I remember this point being brought up when Mussina was about to retire and he had less than 300 wins and no 20-win seasons (at the time). It may have been Al Leiter who brought up the point about the list of 4 or 5 pitchers in the HOF with 100+ more wins than losses.
Andy has 2 20+ win seasons, 100+ more wins than losses, 5 WS Rings, Postseason stats: 19-10 3.83 era. I think what hurts Andy’s chances the most is that he only has 15 seasons in. If Andy had a few gold gloves, they would have enhanced his chances of HOF with only 15 Seasons but I think he would still fall short. If Andy can pitch 2 more years and win another 25 games while maintaining 100+ more wins than losses, it would give him a similar record as Mike Mussina and I think he could get in to the HOF.
i think Andy's ERA hurts him the most
getting into the hall with a 3.83 ERA is very rare. He’d be one of the highest ERAs in the HOF if that were to happen. That plus the whole HGH thing and I’m not sure Andy gets in.
Doesn’t matter to me though. Andy’s one of my favorite pitchers and his number is gonna be up in Monument Park sooner or later anyways.
"I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot."- Kobe Bryant
Please come back Andy!
I forgot all about the HGH
That hurts him the most right now above all else. However, if the voters believe that he only used it “one time” after his injury, they may over look it if they feel the rest of the numbers justify election.
The HGH Thing
If memory serves, Andy testified that he used HGH twice when recovering from an injury, didn’t feel like it was helping his recovery, and stopped. The skeptic in me isn’t quite prepared to believe that without question, but given his overall character I think it’s absolutely plausible. AFAIK there has never been any evidence to suggest Andy did any more than what he said, and he scores points in my book in the way he conducted himself WRT the Congressional hearings, speaking openly about the situation and confronting it head-on rather than hiding or trying to dodge the whole mess.That scores points and makes it more plausible, to me at least, that what he said is in fact the whole truth of the matter. We’ll never know for sure, of course, so this is my best guess.
Contrast that with guys like Bonds, Tejada, and a whole host of others, and in my mind at least, Andy Pettitte is clean.
I personally characterize HGH use as somewhat less damning than steroid use. The impact of HGH is likely less pronounced. If someone wanted to max out on their performance at that point in baseball history, seems to me they’d go straight to the designer steroids, or more likely a combination of both supplements.
I’d have no problem with voting Andy into the Hall in light of the HGH fiasco. As to whether his BASEBALL accomplishments merit it? Not sure on that yet.
There is one small factor regarding HGH
IT is from dead people. Seriously.
I agree with your take on Andy’s past, but don’t count HGH as a casual thing. it is an illegal drug just like steroids. Also, those who take HGH have probably taken steroids as well.
Gardner for President.
When I said "one time", I meant
that there were no other instances in his career that he used HGH not necessarily how many doses he used during the “treatment” or “cycle”.
Taking of Pelham 123 was a great movie. Other than that, depends what kind of movie you are looking for.
Writer for Pinstripe Alley, MLB Daily Dish
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Brandon I do not want to watch movies with you
I thought Pelham was boring and I love Travolta. I really liked Inception but movies are subjective to the viewer, nobody is right or wrong just distastefull in anothers eyes. Personally I like TV shows of the SciFi type and Farscape is my all time favorite. I liked Splice and I think it was called A Perfect Getaway with Mila Jolavich and the dude who played the Sheriff in Deadwood and The Crazies. It was predictable but F’d up just the same. Trying to watch Lexx right now but it is bizarre.
I'm going to take a flyer and predict Cash finally satisfys his boner for Jarrod Washburn before seasons end. Anyone else wonder if Damons bed is one of those WWE ring with ropes sleeper? I'm looking for volunters to try out my new taser (only bandwagoners need apply).
by cashman bashman on Jan 8, 2011 9:22 PM EST up reply actions
+1
I saw that on a trans-Pacific flight. I’ll third this recommendation.
Usqueadbaugham! Anam muck an dhoul ! Did ye drink me doornail?
The fact that you called yourself out
Cancels out the entire reply fail
March 31st can't come soon enough.
by Chris McKeown on Jan 7, 2011 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
Other Netflix recommendations
I rather liked “Moon,” which isn’t a spectacle at all, but contains some brilliant acting.
We just watched “Badlands” on Netflix which has some beautiful cinematography.
Check out “Fast, Cheap, and Out of Control” for an unusual documentary. (Although “Vernon, Florida” surpasses it for unusual subject matter.)
Finally, check out Luis Bunuel’s “The Exterminating Angel.” Hopefully Netflix has the Criterion edition, because the older prints weren’t so good.
Usqueadbaugham! Anam muck an dhoul ! Did ye drink me doornail?
Soriano and Andy
Andy has the numbers, and I think the voters will be more forgiving as time goes by, and Andy’s explanation for his steroid use whether you believe it or not is except able.
I like the idea of getting Soriano. This gives us 2 closers, and he can pitch on those days when Rivera can’t. It also gives us insurance if Mp gets hurt (I hope he never does) but he is a bigger risk now. If we can get 6 innings out of our starters and turn it over to a lock-down bp that will include MO and Soriano, I think we could have the best pen in the AL.
Good Point
That’s an excellent point about being able to pitch when Mo can’t. You’ve convinced me. But I’d still like to consider Soria as well. It goes without saying that 2 inning outings will be harder for Mo as the years pass.
+1. There’s more to getting Soriano than just having a great-but-expensive set-up man—we also have him in place to become the closer when Mo retires after 2012 (assuming he does, but I think there’s a very good chance he will). I can see opposing the idea, but claiming that it’s not even worthy of debate seems excessive, to say the least. It’s not a “kneejerk reaction” to the failure to land Lee, simply a solution to the current lack-of-setup-man problem and the future no-Mo problem (which will be huge).
Evidently George Steinbrenner was the ultimate wagoner.
Your fellow Yankee fans are not the enemy.
by Yankee Frankee on Jan 7, 2011 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Pinstripe Alley
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Snoop Dogg delivers memorable first pitch at U.S. Cellular Field
- The Juice: Mesoraco’s grand slam helps Reds complete four-game sweep of Braves
- Please hold: Indians’ Joe Smith jumps the gun on relief appearance
- Local radio host honors Cubs’ Tony Campana with parody song
- Roy Halladay bobblehead with glove on wrong hand selling on MLB.com
