The Yankees Prospect Dilemma: Part 1
The Yankees are stuck between a rock and a hard place when it comes to prospects.
We generally see a team half-filled with All-Stars. Jeter, Arod and Mo are future first-ballot Hall of Famers (discounting any voting effects of PED usage). Pettitte, Posada, Tex and Sabathia (maybe Cano?) all have chances of making it.
The worst everyday hitter on the team is Curtis Granderson, sporting a 99 OPS+. That is a hair below average (though he's an above average player when taking into account defense and baserunning). Every other hitter is over 100. They have the top lineup in baseball (115 OPS+) and lead the league in scoring.
The pitchers have the fourth best ERA in the league (seventh best ERA+), and allow only 4.09 runs/game (a hair off the fourth place Twins at 4.08).
In other words, the Yankees employ good players. It's tough to crack the team. And that creates a problem for up-and-comers in the system. A prospect has to almost be among the top 10 in MLB to have a chance. Let's look at the last five everyday players to come up from the farm (via the draft or IFA signing):
In chronological order -
Alfonso Soriano, Nick Johnson, Robinson Cano, Melky Cabrera and Brett Gardner
Two All-Stars, an OBP machine, and two average all-around players. That's a pretty high bar - and don't discount average players, especially ones that are under team control.
The pitchers:
Chien-Ming Wang, Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain, Phil Coke and Dave Robertson
Again, a Cy Young runner-up, an All-Star and three solid set-up men. Are you noticing a pattern here? Not just anybody breaks onto the Yankees - you really need to excel to get a look, then remain an everyday player, or on a few occasions, play a position of need when the current Yankee isn't cutting it (e.g. Cano/Womack in '05, Joba/whoever in '07).
Those prospects that aren't excelling or are playing positions of strength have a tough time getting promoted to the Bronx.
The question is: when should prospects be traded and when should they be kept? Once they get to their mid-20s, the luster fades and their trade value drops. Is it worth it to keep a prospect wallowing in the minors for 'depth,' trade him for an area of need, or force him onto the ML roster?
Let's look back at some past prospects/youngsters who were traded away -
Traded to Arizona in a package for Randy Johnson before the 2005 season, Navarro was the Yankees' top catching prospect. His age 19, 2003 season was his best: .321/.376/.469 in 110 games between High-A and Double-A, while throwing out 33% of potential base-stealers. 2004 was a down year for him (.263/.341/.366 in AA and AAA), but he was still highly thought of, at least enough to help land The Big Unit. In hindsight, the Yankees made the correct call, as Jorge Posada has remained a productive player into his late 30's and have a system loaded with catching talent while Navarro's had just one good ML season: 2008, when he hit .295/.349/.407 and gunned down 38% of base-stealers. Other than that, he's been a disappointment and is currently in Triple-A; however, the guy is only 26, so a productive career is still not out of the question.
Verdict: didn't hurt.
Jose Tabata, OF
Traded to Pittsburgh in a package for Damaso Marte and Xavier Nady in mid-2008, Tabata was promoted to the Bigs about two months ago and has showed the kind of solid contact ability (.303/.353/.394) that made him a top Yankee prospect not long ago. He'd been having off-the-field issues before he was traded: he didn't always hustle and apparently considered retiring at 19. He was traded at his lowest value (hitting .248/.320/.310 at the time), then went on a tear in the Pirates system.
This is a really tough call. It's possible Tabata would have never fulfilled his potential with the Yankees and needed a 'change of scenery.' On the other hand, I was never a big supporter of the trade simply for the fact that he was sold low and the return really wasn't that good (even before the injuries to Marte and Nady).
Verdict: jury's still out.
Eric Duncan, 3B/1B
Remember him? Eric Duncan was once the jewel of the system, supposedly the future first-baseman, yet he never OPS'd higher than .836 and declined every season from his first year on. The Yankees held onto him way too long and finally released him last year. From there he signed with Atlanta (he's now playing for their Double-A team).
This scenario is basically the worst of both worlds: he was never traded and turned into a dud. That's what we don't want to happen with guys like Eduardo Nunez, Corban Joseph, Brandon Laird, etc., prospects who aren't superstars in the making but could fetch a decent return via trade. Admittedly, it's tough; how do you know who are the Jeters, Canos and Pettittes and who are the Eric Duncans? Sometimes it's just luck: the Yankees nearly traded Mo Rivera and Jorge Posada to the Reds in the early 90's and Cano was nearly traded in place of Navarro for Randy Johnson.
Verdict: should have been traded.
Ian Kennedy, RHP
Traded to Arizona in the Curtis Granderson deal, Kennedy was never that highly thought of due to his low-risk, low-reward nature (he's having a decent season in Arizona). And as we saw above, a guy like that doesn't really have a place on a team like the New York Yankees, except maybe in the bullpen. He's worth more to, frankly, a middling team like the D'Backs than a $200M team. Kennedy never would've had a place in the Yankees' rotation (I thought he would've been a damn good reliever), but Brian Cashman thought it better to get a (thought to be) star centerfielder. It's still too early to judge this one, but if Grandy can even approach his '07-'08 seasons, it'll leave the Yankees with no regrets.
Verdict: jury's still out.
Austin Jackson, CF
Traded to Detroit for Curtis Granderson, this one might end up hurting the most: Jackson is a front-runner for AL Rookie of the Year, batting .301/.351/.400 with 16 steals. He went from appearing like a five-tool prospect into more of a batting average and speed kind of player (not that there's anything wrong with that) without much power or discipline: 1 HR and 122 K. That said, he's still been more productive than Granderson this season and is 23 making the league minimum - in other words, he's much more valuable. Only time will tell if giving up A-Jax was a mistake, but the early returns aren't good.
Verdict: jury's still out.
Melky Cabrera, OF
Traded to Atlanta in the Javy Vazquez deal, Melky was an enigma during his four years with the Yankees. He looked so promising in 2006 when he hit for average and showed discipline (.280/.360/.391, 56 K, 59 BB) at age 21. Unfortunately, the league seemed to catch up to him: he OPS'd .718 and .641 the following two seasons. His best season was 2009, when he posted a 99 OPS+, and that's when the Yankees traded him. They apparently didn't think he could maintain or progress from that point, so they swapped him at what they thought was his highest value. It looks like the right move, as Melky's had a disappointing first year with the Braves (90 OPS+).
Verdict: probably won't end up hurting.
Overall, we see that Brian Cashman has made largely solid decisions, especially considering the win-now philosophy of the Steinbrenner Yankees. None of the prospects the Yankees traded away in recent years have turned into superstars (yet).
- Part 2 coming soon - the prospects that were held onto and those that are going to be tough decisions in the coming years.
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A great recap. I think it’s also worth remembering the prospects who were traded who didn’t make the big leagues or who flamed out. Guys like Brad Halsey and Yhency Brazoban were part of the deals for RJ and Kevin Brown (respectively) and while they didn’t become stars, for any team on a budget, getting a good season or two at league minimum goes a long way to making or breaking the budget.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
agreed - I love posts like this
really tests the old memory. I’m curious why Juan Rivera wasn’t included with Soriano and Nick Johnson. After all, he accompanied Johnson to Montreal for Vazquez prior to the 04 season. For Montreal that year he hit .307 with 12 hrs and 49 rbis. He has also been solid in Anaheim. Considering the revolving door of overpaid veterans we had in right field before Swish surprised us all, it would have bee interesting to see him stick around. He had a rocket for an arm too.
If you're a real Yankee fan, please do the rest of us a favor and splurge the extra cash on a replica jersey without a last name on the back. Frankly, it's embarassing.
by total hermination on Aug 16, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Very good work
I still wonder if Wang will ever again get close to where he was with us for a few years there.
"He wasn't an astronaut, he was a tv comedian! And he was just using space travel as a metaphor for beating his wife!"
I wonder that as well
I think his prime is past though.. I figured he’d be back by now.
"Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next." -George Michael Steinbrenner III
by Chris McKeown on Aug 16, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions
He's better off on Atlanta sadly
"Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next." -George Michael Steinbrenner III
by Chris McKeown on Aug 16, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions
one can argue Cano is better off too
If you're a real Yankee fan, please do the rest of us a favor and splurge the extra cash on a replica jersey without a last name on the back. Frankly, it's embarassing.
by total hermination on Aug 18, 2010 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions
a good post but
i think the melky trade cant be judged until Arodys Vizcaino either develops or doesnt. If he fulfills his potential as a number 1 or 2 starter with the braves than we certainly didnt get the better end of the deal, especially with Vasquez likely being nothing more than an 11 million dollar rental (unless of course we can get 2 picks if he declines arbitration).
Arody is really a question mark
he has great stuff but tons of issues with his health. I don’t think he has yet to pitch a full season. Injuries are something an aging team like the yanks don’t want to deal with especially it’s with a young pitcher.
"if Grandy can even approach his '07-'08 seasons"
Ain’t happenin. Meanwhile, if Kennedy and Jackson were still with the team, they’d be the fifth pitcher and the fourth outfielder (or third). So while it wasn’t a bust, we can say that the results are disappointing.
Kennedy the 5th pitcher?
So what your saying is one of CC, AJ, Pettitte, Hughes, Javy would be in the bullpen? I dont think so
Kennedy was not gonna be a #5 pitcher
Mitre or Gaudin would’ve never let it happen
by FreeBradshaw on Aug 16, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Ian Kennedy = scrub
"Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next." -George Michael Steinbrenner III
by Chris McKeown on Aug 16, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Posada and Mo
what was the trade that would have sent them to Cincy in the early 90’s? The O’Neill deal? Just curious.
If you're a real Yankee fan, please do the rest of us a favor and splurge the extra cash on a replica jersey without a last name on the back. Frankly, it's embarassing.
by total hermination on Aug 16, 2010 3:19 PM EDT reply actions
if its true thats crazy
Glad they waited until the mid 90’s to make that move. Would we have won in ‘96? Would Wells have pitched a perfect game in ’98 with another guy behind the plate? Who knows and i’m glad it didn’t go down like that.
If you're a real Yankee fan, please do the rest of us a favor and splurge the extra cash on a replica jersey without a last name on the back. Frankly, it's embarassing.
by total hermination on Aug 16, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Heres a link
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/06/revisiting-an-almost-trade-of-mariano-rivera-13917/ I can only imagine how things would have been different if it would have happened
Good stuff Travis
the Yanks may not have an entire team flooded with players from their farm, but it takes a strong egg to crack this team and play everyday.
I think the hardest one for the Yankees is....
The Melky – Vasquez deal……
Tho Melky has been disappointing for the braves and Javvy has filled the role we needed him to,
You have to compare what Javvy is doing for us compare to what Melky did for us last year.
Not to mention the chemistry Melky had with the team and being the Walkoff King.
by Gangsta Yanksta on Aug 16, 2010 6:42 PM EDT reply actions
but then again...
Gardner probably wouldn’t have developed the way he did this year….. but if Granderson had some competition for center…… its crazy you really never know how things will play out
by Gangsta Yanksta on Aug 16, 2010 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions
nothing would have been different
because even if they didn’t trade Melky, they may have still gotten Granderson, or made him compete with Austin Jackson for the last OF spot.
Gardner proved last year that he would win the starting spot again. And Melky actually owes his trade value (his great 2009 season and all his walk-offs) to Gardner’s injury and DL stint. Otherwise, Melky was the back up OF (read 4th OF) and would not have had any value in a trade for Vazquez. Then the Yankees would have had to trade Vizcaino, Melky, and someone else from the system to get Vazquez and Logan.
Vazquez!
"Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next." -George Michael Steinbrenner III
by Chris McKeown on Aug 16, 2010 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Do we really need nothing but superstars?
I personally don’t care if the Yankees have some guys who don’t set the world on fire. Did Melky really set the world on fire last year? No but he came up huge in the big spots. Guys like Austin Jackson and Melky Cabrera would underachieve on a team like this and in a big way. I had 0 problem with having Gardner/Jackson platooning in center and Melky playing left. None. With the aging guys on this team, it needs as much versatility as possible to DH guys like Posada, A-Rod and Jeter. I also personally believe Jackson would hit for more power in Yankee stadium, how many games did he play there this year? 2? 1 homerun? Look at that! hes hittin .500 in Yankee Stadium ;)

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