Beat writers bash Posada after brawl
by Ed Valentine on Sep 16, 2009 7:48 AM EDT
in New York Yankees News
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PrintOK, so I bailed on the game early and missed the festivities. Seems the Yankees and Blue Jays just could not wait to bring boxing to the Bronx.
Here are a few takes on Fight Night in the Bronx from around the Inter-Google. Seems like most of the Yankee beat writers are critical of Jorge Posada for getting involved in the whole mess.
Jesse Carlson is a two-bit middle reliever on a fourth-place team, a 28-year-old guy who has been with four organizations. No matter where he stands or what he says or anything else, Jorge Posada needs to avoid confrontation. Give Carlson a dirty look. Don’t give MLB a reason to suspend you.
Jorge Posada can say whatever he wants, he is 100 percent responsible for the bench-clearing brawl that took place between the Yankees and Blue Jays on Tuesday night.
He ought to know better.
I know Posada is a fiery player whose heart and passion have made him the inspirational leader of this team for several years, but as a veteran who has been through it all, he should have recognized that a brawl was the last thing the Yankees needed with less than three weeks to go before the playoffs.
The Yankees got lucky that nobody was seriously injured during the fracas.
If the manager is the most seriously injured Yankee, that is a relief for the team. As much as Posada helps with his passion and fire, on Tuesday he put his teammates at risk. C.C. Sabathia or Joba Chamberlain could have wound up like the Red Sox’ Bill Lee in 1976, emerging from the melee with a separated shoulder.
Manager Joe Girardi's reaction? He wasn't too happy with the whole event.
"We’ve already had a discussion," he said. "I told them there is a lot at stake here and we can’t afford to get anyone hurt or lose anyone or get people suspended. We can’t do that."
As I said, I did not see the fracas. I have to agree, though, with the sentiment that this was a stupid thing for Posada and the Yankees to get involved. They had everything to lose and nothing to gain.
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Is anyone else aside from Posada and Girardi
gonna get suspended?
The thing I wanna know is where was Cervelli in all this? Couldn’t he realistically snapped his fingers and caused everyone to simply shake hands and move on?
Or maybe he wants Posada out of the way for a few games to show why he is a God.
What the f$%k is the internet?
There will probably be suspensions and fines for a bunch of players.
It will effect more Yanks than Jays.
They’ll go over the tape and decide who was the problem. Damon seemed to get in the middle of it pretty quickly, as did Shelley.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
“I told them there is a lot at stake here and we can’t afford to get anyone hurt or lose anyone or get people suspended. We can’t do that.”
Partially agree. Of course no one wants anybody to be injured… but a couple days off for Posada or another veteran via a suspension is not exactly the end of the world here.
i shed no tears for shelley.
damon could use a few days off anyway…
by tombradylikesdudes on Sep 16, 2009 10:00 AM EDT reply actions
ya know what?
If MLB wants brawls to end, do as the NHL does….let the two players go at it, and anyone else who jumps in is suspended or whatever. That way they can mainly worry about the pitcher/hitter fighting and not the whole team. Don’t let anyone leave the bench or you’re gone for 2 weeks.
That’ll fix that. Oh, and no pay.
I think in baseball alot of the people who rush out
aren’t going to fight they are going to get their teammates out of the situation. This fight seems to be the exception as there was a lot of punches thrown. But most the time when benches clear the people who are coming off the bench are grabbing their own players. CC carried Posada off the field and Posada looks like he would have wanted to stay.
Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.
by Edwantsacracker on Sep 16, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions
JLO
As a Jays fan, this pissed me off! Yankee pitchers have hit 6 Jays batters in September, including Hill who is our best player and an all-star. The Jays did not respond until last night. Posada is a vet player – instead of cheap shots he should be wondering what took the Jays so long to retaliate?
the two last night
were by mitre, who can’t hit the broad side of a barn and a rookie who has a bunch of walks so he has been a little wild.
by justinxyankeesfan on Sep 16, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Barajas should also have been ejected
No argument that Jorge’s elbow was a bush league cheap shot. But the very instant he did it, he was tossed by the ump. No hesitation at all, and Jorge kept going toward the dugout (and eventually clubhouse, I imagine). Carlson turned around and started jawing, which is understandable, but Barajas was the one who, after the ejection, went tearing after Posada and that triggered the brawl. Not sure how Carlson gets ejected and Barajas does not. In fact, if it were not for Barajas, Carlson would not have walked away with a giant goose egg on his noggin. He got whacked pretty good. Way to risk one of your pitchers, Barajas.
Oh, and way to unnecessarily risk several of your own teammates, Jorge. You got the run, you should have just made a wise ass comment and moved on.
Nobody is trying to hit your team
Your team has been irrelevant since May. It would be like plunking the fat kid on the other team. What’s the point.
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Sep 16, 2009 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Does that represent the percent chance you will ever see your team in a WS again in your lifetime?
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Sep 16, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
You know as a Yankees fan, sometimes you just have to tip your hat. That was a winner.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
just so u know
the pitcher who hit all those jays in september is aaa pitcher at best melocon or however u spell his name has mechanical problems hes letting his front shoulder open up and the ball has been up and in alot
What the hell?
Jesse Carlson is a two-bit middle reliever on a fourth-place team, a 28-year-old guy who has been with four organizations. No matter where he stands or what he says or anything else, Jorge Posada needs to avoid confrontation
Why take a shot at Carlson? He was standing up for his hitters. Like the Muppet said above, the Yanks have been peppering the Jays this fall including Ruiz getting hit in the face. Carlson did EXACTLY what he should have done…throw behind Posada to send a message. I don’t understand what Carlson did to piss off Peter Abraham to call him a two-bit reliever. He’s struggled this year yes, but last year he was one of the best pitchers in our bullpen (We actually had a good pitching staff last year…sigh)
RIP Bodhi - Not tragic to die doing what you love. You want the ultimate thrill, you gotta be willing to pay the ultimate price.
by craig in calgary on Sep 16, 2009 11:19 AM EDT reply actions
This “two-bit” reliever has a better WHIP than most Yankees pitcher. But I guess that kind of uninformed commentary is what we can expect from a two-bit blogger, 3rd-tier sports reporter, wannabe like Peter Abraham.
by aagoodfella on Sep 16, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
oh yea, and Carlson is having an off season and still generates better WHIP than most Yankees
by aagoodfella on Sep 16, 2009 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions
ummm...
STANDINGS. take a look at them before you talk crap, dude.
by NumberSeven on Sep 16, 2009 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
He's not talking crap about the Yanks
He’s simply pointing out that Carlson isn’t a “two-bit middle reliever” as the hack Peter Abraham so eloquently put it.
RIP Bodhi - Not tragic to die doing what you love. You want the ultimate thrill, you gotta be willing to pay the ultimate price.
by craig in calgary on Sep 16, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
You do realized WHIP for Relievers and Starters can not compare?
And if you really want to compare WHIP CC has 1.13 over carlson’s 1.15 and he is a starter… And if you want to compare relievers let see hmm.. hughes and Mo have a WHIP barely over 1 which is less than carlson’s 1.15. Hell even phil oke has a lower WHIp than carlson…how bout u do some research next time?
The Muppet
Carlson has a career 3.37 ERA and over 100 strikeouts in only 123 innings. Judging by the Yankees bullpen last night, Carlson would be a welcomed addition!
I agree that he would be a welcomed addition
He’s a LOT better than Marte. And probably younger too (although I don’t know how old he is). Although, you can’t compare him to the Yankees bullpen last night. Yes, he’s better than the pitchers the Yankees had last night, but last night the Yankees sent September call ups out there. Not our real bullpen. You didn’t see Coke, Bruney, Hughes, Aceves, or Rivera, and those 5 guys are the main part of our bullpen. You can’t judge the Yankees bullpen by last nights performance.
The Muppet
were by mitre, who can’t hit the broad side of a barn and a rookie who has a bunch of walks so he has been a little wild.
True enough. I guess mistakes or not, after 6 unanswered hit batters maybe we can all agree that the Yanks deserve one just on principle. Even if it was just a not so polite way of asking Yankee pitchers to clean it up a bit.
Yeah I have no problem with the Yanks getting thrown at
I have no problem with Posada jawing back. Jorge should have just calmed the eff down and gone back to the dugout, maybe he forgot he was playing the AAA Canadian affiliate.
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Sep 16, 2009 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Interesting:
If I’m reading my stats correctly, the Yankees lead all of baseball in beaning opposition players while they rank 14 in getting hit.
Posada has been hit all of twice this entire season. If anybody deserved to lose their minds out there it’s Texiera who has been hit 11 times.
shit happens
not a good time for a brawl. but does anybody remember torre coaching when jeter and alf.sorriano were hit all the time, and nothing was done in pay back?
BIG YANKEE FAN,FROM MASS. HAVE TO PUT UP WIYH ALL THESE HOLE SOX FANS
nice to see the fucking trolls are out in force
Here’s the deal…I have no problem with Carlson throwing behind Jorge. I have no issue with him being pissed about it either. But I do have an issue with where Carlson ws standing at the plate. You don’t stand in that location to back up your catcher. He was standing there cause he wanted to start some shit and got his ass beat for it. I for one this will just further build the team unity and no one was hurt so no harm no foul.
by swanny4eva on Sep 16, 2009 1:18 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Yea seriously...
No one points out that he was out of position by standing near home plate. I mean unless he decides to take the catcher’s job of guarding home plate, he should be either behind it to back up the catcher or no where near it.
I do agree that he was out of position, however...
If you take a look at the replays that the NY TV station had, you see how it wound up. Carlson’s throwing action drops him off hard towards the 1st base line. He saw the hit and saw that the a play at the plate was unlikely and jogged slowly towards home to get in position just in case. He didn’t get past home in time so he stopped to let Posada go through. He made no motion toward Posada and flat out ignored him until Posada made contact.
(I found the highlights on the bluejays.com video section if you’re looking for the one I’m talking about. It’s pretty late in the ~5 minute clip as the announcers start discussing what happened and why.)
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
that's exactly right
watch it again. Carlson’s pissed because he just gave up a run after get mouthed off by Posada for very professionally sending the Yankees a necessary message without even plunking the guy. He knows there’s no throw coming, that run is a given. He’s going to cover home (lazily, but he is), but the ump gets in his way, then he waits for Posada, trying to stay out of his way. Posada obviously does nothing to avoiding clipping him, and Carlson is justifiably pissed. Cue melee.
Wasn't out of position
The play didn’t come home. Carlson was out of position because he fell to the left side and didn’t hustle in to back up the plate.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
douche move Jorge!
super cheap shot, seems like Jorge wasn’t paying attention to what was going on in the game ….again. i wish he broke his hand doing something that stupid.
I'm a lifelong Yankees fan ... it was a cheap shot by an otherwise great player
I’m glad he didn’t get hurt. And I’m thrilled he didn’t get anyone else hurt …
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
By MIKE FITZPATRICK, AP Baseball Writer
“After scoring on Brett Gardner’s(notes) double, Posada jostled Carlson, who was on his way to back up the plate. Joyce promptly ejected Posada as Carlson shouted curses at the star catcher.”
Did everyone see this differntly?
I saw Carlson Standing behind home plate inline with third base, the guy was staring like a deer in headlights, at what I don’t know but it was not Posada, Posada was half way down the third base line at this point.
When Posada reached home he was still standing staring and it looked like blocking part of Posada’s path to home plate.
I did not see Posada’s elbow come up until after the glove hit Posada.
I did see Posada continue a good twenty feet heading to the dugout and only turned after Carlson said #$&#^%#^& who knows what LOL
I guess everyone does see things differently.
One thing I do know is that Jorge Posada is a class act, and whatever this kid said to him….., well he has a knot on his head for it LMAO!
obviously the only way you would be satisfied is if Carlson stayed on the mound instead of covering the possible throw to home as any other pitcher in the damn league would do. Take off your rose-tinted glasses and smell the coffee for gosh sakes.
You are truly offering up the most deluded perspective of this incident that could possibly be voiced in public. I am embarrassed for you. Oh by the way, were you a member of the OJ jury?
i was thinking of something clever to say
But I decided to just tell you to shut the fuck up and go back to the website that covers your bottom dwelling last place team.
by swanny4eva on Sep 16, 2009 4:07 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You are a Yankees fan. It goes without saying, the Jays will have won two more World Series by the time you figure out something clever to say.
pretty sure
there most be a MLB team in Toronto by then
Mike, Mike, Mike ...
Carlson didn’t block Posada …
Posada was looking for a fight and in the heat of the moment saw his chance to touch it off.
This is all on Posada …
He knows how the game is played. He jawed after getting hit and then should have cooled down on first. He didn’t do that, and could have cost us immeasureably for his move. Thankfully it didn’t happen.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
Who cares
As long as Posada resting for 5 days doesn’t hurt the team too bad it’s all good. Not a smart move by Jorge… BUUUUUUT I like seeing fire in Jorge’s belly. Good things happen when has a chip on his shoulder as Pedro can attest.
by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Sep 16, 2009 2:04 PM EDT reply actions
+1
i generally don’t have a problem with fights in sports. it’s a very passionate game for fans so you can only imagine the high level of emotions from the men who actually play the sport.
so it’s nice to see the passion and fire from the players from time to time.
however, as my mother likes to say, “it’s all fun and games until someone loses an eye”
but whenever there is a fight, I’m reminded of the Pistons/Pacers brawl at Auburn Hills when the fans got involved.
Thank God for making us Yankees.
Rice into the stands...
I was on the aisle when Rice bolted into the stands to get his hat. The fan fights that touched off were spectacular! I watched a guy in a Red Sux hat punch his buddy (a Yankee fan) right in the face while the dude drank his beer—essentially the stadium equivalent of dumping gas on smoldering embers…. Good times… Good times.
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
I hate to say it, but that was pretty stupid by Posada.
Honestly, we didn’t need that. I love the Yankees and I love Posada, but do we really need to start a fight 3 weeks before the playoffs? Risk injury and suspension against a team that we’re seeing a total of one more time this year? Not worth it. Burnett’s been sucking lately, Joba’s innings are still low. And Pettitte’s out for a start. We don’t need more problems right now. It’s a good thing the one injured most by this was our manager. Could you imagine if Torre was still managing and was in that position? He would have been torn apart. Girardi’s still younger though so he’s okay (thankfully). Good thing nobody got hurt.
Now, I love bench clearing brawls. They’re exciting and they fire up a team. But they have to be at the right time. And against a bad team in a game where we were down by 6, 3 weeks before the playoffs with a 7 game lead, was not the right time.
The truth
He may have power but I would give him up for a spunky kid with a arm. Someone that batted 280+ and could call a great game .. Don’t get it wrong Im a Yankee fan since 1970… Posoda has passion but I swear I think he overrated.. Again let me be clear I have know problem with the brawl it’s posada.. And where was jeter… He’s never get into anything
by BrownHornet . on Sep 16, 2009 6:19 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Posada and Duncan will both sit for 3 games. Jorge gets the rest that he needs and will be back for the series against the Angels
Thank God for making us Yankees.
shelley been sitting since
he got called up, haha…. the brawl is the most action he got so far
by Gangsta Yanksta on Sep 16, 2009 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions
the way i see it, if carlson hit posada
if would have been a much different situation.
the fact he threw behind him…. eliminates any misconception of an accident.
Carlson has a lot of balls… but you know what. From what i saw, he got it the worse of anyone. gashed up and bleeding some
by Gangsta Yanksta on Sep 16, 2009 7:31 PM EDT reply actions
The last thing we need
is someone like Sabbathia or Burnett getting hurt in a senseless brawl. Jorge was not thinking at all. The Jays are nothing right now and I don’t understand why Jorge would give any Jays player the time of day, let alone incite a bench clearing brawl.
by PinstripedinMN on Sep 16, 2009 10:08 PM EDT reply actions
It would be hard to keep your head
if you are already kind of pissed and then you get ejected for doing almost nothing. If you are going to eject people for brushing against somebody, why not toss the pitcher every time they hit a batter?
If that's all Posada did...
then I agree…
but the cameras didn’t look at Posada after Carlson started mouthing off. Carlson said something first, the ump then looked at him, then Posada.
Who knows what Jorge said, but I doubt it was anything like “could you pass the Grey Poupon?”.
I doubt they ejected Jorge for the arm thing, the ump didn’t even see it.
What the f$%k is the internet?
by FreeBradshaw on Sep 17, 2009 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Get over it, already.
Carlson had no business sending Posada a “message” via a stupid pitch. More players get hurt via pitched balls than any other source except sliding. If he wants to send Jorge a message, then text him, like everybody else. If some mickey mouse rag arm throws at me, I go after him just to balance the equation.
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