Matt Holliday compared to Nick Swisher

by jeter751 on Jun 18, 2009 10:38 PM EDT Comment 15 comments

Many of you may think that Nick Swisher is a great guy. And he is. However, is he great at baseball? His stats tell another story...

After an amazing April in which he and Cano basically led the Yankees he has been on and off. It seems like he is just going to be very streaky this year. Terrible one time and great another. However his 2-4 game today really pissed me off. Not only was he too anxious to get a double he killed the Yankees rally with that double play. (Man i hate those).

Not to mention his poor poor poor fielding. He makes the occasional wonder play. However he makes it look so good only because he cant get there in time. Take a Mike Cameron and he'll make those plays and make them look easy.

Lets take a look at his numbers:

12 Homers: Great stat.

35 RBIs: Pretty good.

And heres the ugly...

239 avg.

4 errors and countless plays he should have made. (One was changed today to an error.)

At best he is a 4th outfielder and a good backup first basemen. And possibly our best pitcher. 0.00 era.

I think the Yankees should try to trade for Matt Holiday. The guy is great. His power numbers have been was off this year because he is not hitting in Coors.

Heres a look at Holliday's numbers:

8 Homers in an unfriendly hitting park. Take him to the New Coors Field

38 RBIs: bad year for him.

275 avg. Not good not 239 bad though. He could give us the power we need in the outfield.

And i know that Nady will be coming back soon. But could he hit well. Could he field well. He is coming back from missing a little over 2 months.

Holliday is having a terrible year but i think that it could easily be fixed if he comes to the Yankees. He isnt a perrinial All Star and possible MVP candidate mostly every season for no reason.

Poll

Who would be better for the Yankees?

Matt Holliday

75 votes

Nick Swisher

39 votes

114 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs | Comment 15 comments

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Comments

I ain't gonna bash you here

but you really didn’t give any reason why Holliday is ‘better’, cuz he’s not.

I ain’t one to go all Sabermetric on people, but yea .239 isn’t good, but actually Swish has a .886 OPS right now to Holliday’s .808.

Swisher’s actually the better player this year, bonehead baserunning and OF play aside.

Plus he cost a WHOLE LOT less, as in money AND getting Wilson Betemit off the team.

Holliday is actually having a worse season than Derek Jeter. Good, but for an OF who doesn’t steal any bases either? Nah, too much.

by FreeBradshaw on Jun 18, 2009 10:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

U raise

a helluva argument. And I’m starting to believe his chemistry factor is wearing off. He is patient at the plate yes. But I think we have seen the best of him already.

by ReggieARodJeter on Jun 18, 2009 11:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

tough call

i prayed in the offseason for the yanks not to go near holliday just knowing that without coors field he would not be the same guy. i think swish is also a big help in the club house. always joking around and keeping everyone loose. need a guy like that when we have the most strict clubhouse in all of baseball.. but i see your argument.

by NYyankswlb on Jun 19, 2009 12:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Holliday

only comes after the year is over to replace our outfield

Cano is a Pimp

by yankeechaser on Jun 19, 2009 1:29 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

At what expense?

You can be certain that Billy Beane will, as usual, attempt to maximize his return on Holliday. Phil Hughes’ name will be on the top of that trade list. Can the Yankees afford to trade him now given the uncertainty of CHW’s ability to pitch well?

Getting Holliday doesn’t make sense right now unless we can trade away (very doubtful) Damon or Matsui. With him, there’s going to be one huge logjam at the DH spot.

And then, of course, we don’t know if it’s a sure thing that Holliday’s subpar season thus far can be so “easily” fixed while playing outside of Coors Field.

by BigSlim on Jun 19, 2009 1:47 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

huh?

Since you decided to pull something out of your ass without actually looking deeper into the splits.

Matt Holliday on the road 2009

.299/.386/.449

Nick Swisher on the road 2009

.298/ 392/.663

Nick Swisher spent most of his career in OAKLAND. Matt Holliday before this year was all in COORS FIELD. using park as a debate IN FAVOR OF HOLLIDAY is just hilarious.

Also. I think you don’t even know that Matt Holliday bats right handed. that or you never seen the games and where all the HR is going out in New Yankee stadium.

Maybe you can comprehend this chart
http://www.hittrackeronline.com/detail.php?id=2009_1536&type=hitter

this is Matt Hollidays’s home run chart. I’m surrrre he’s going to take HUUUUUGE advantage of the RIGHT FIELD porch .

Matt Holliday was a overrated player due to Coors, he’s good . but he’s not the MVP caliber guy that he looked like in Oakland, he is in fact. a similar player to Nick Swisher. better contact. but similar power. and Nick will walk more.

If I had a gun to my head I would take Holliday over Swisher sure. but that’s not the point is it? Swisher’s still under a very reasonable contract for the next few year while Holliday is a 31 year old who will likely be asking for 15m+ per and 5+ years. all that for a slight upgrade? no thank you.

the Yankees will need to sign a OF regardless anyway. because Damon / Nady / Matsui are all FAs after this year. but if you ask me, the only guy that migth be avalibe that I would consider going long term with is actually Carl Crawford, due to age (he’s 27!) and a much more atheletic skill set. Neither Bay nor Holliday strike me as guys who will age gracefully.

Failing that , they probalby do better just bringing Damon back for a year and go from there.

by RollingWave on Jun 19, 2009 4:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

LF 2010

Crawford would be a great pickup for 2010 but unfortunately the Rays have an option on him and if they did trade him I doubt it’d be in the division. Holliday and Bay are the premier free agents so you have to figure the Yankees will be in on one or the other since they’re losing 32 mil in outfield salary. Holliday’s market value has dropped a lot so he might be had for Matsui/Damon money as opposed to Bay who’s gonna get 16-18 per. Damon can probably do better than a 1-yr deal so if the Yankees want him back they’ll have to make more of a commitment then “keep Damon for a year sign Crawford in 2011.” DH will be open but Posada’s going to need some of those at bats.

There’s also cheaper, higher risk options like Rick Ankiel or just bringing Nady back. Historically the Yankees don’t go that route especially when they have money to spend, so if I had to guess I think we’ll see Holliday or Bay in left, A-Jax in center and Swisher in right.

by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Jun 19, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

pretty much how i feel, Crawford’s option seems like it’ll be picked up, though this being the Rays’ you never know. I think a one year deal bringing Damon back seems likely at this point, Bay isn’t the type of guy I want (bad defense. seems to be a guy that won’t hold up long term) , Crawford is the type of guy that would make me feel better (still just at the start of his prime. great speed, great contact, great defense. )

Basically, the Yankees should only sign huge contracts if they feel the guy is a hall of fame caliber type talent. Jeter and A-rod are obviously no doubters. CC is that sort of talent too, if durability holds up . Teixiera is more borderline but if he’s career year is still ahead of him that might change. (he is after all, still on the right side of 30) so I had no problem with these two. it’s the mid end deals for guys who obviously aren’t HOF talents that really bother me (Pavano / Burnett types) in these cases, they should get creative and fill the void with more reasonablly priced guys like Swisher (good trade) or internal options (guys like Cabrera / Gardner)

Neither Bay nor Holliday are likely hall of famers. hell Carl Crawford might actually be a more likely HOFer (look at his hit rate and steals. he has about as many hits as Derek Jeter at the same age, and he’s likely to finish with 700ish steals) a brief look at their sim scores give a gigantic edge to Crawford, who has guys like Sam Crawford , Roberto Clemente , Ricky Henderson and Tim Raines all on his comps. where as Bay and Holliday are a bunch of borderline sluggers like David Parker or Larry Walker

by RollingWave on Jun 19, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What gets me...

is all the talk here and elsewhere the Yanks are run so poorly, that they need to get younger, build from within, blahblahblah. Then when a big FA pops up- everybody’s clamoring for the Yanks to open the checkbook back up.

Do you really want another huge contract on the books, for a 30 year-old outfielder? I don’t. Let somebody else overpay for him- because he will get paid.

by NumberSeven on Jun 19, 2009 11:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Holliday will only get a 3 year deal

This year has been terrble for Holliday. he still is great. 2005 he hit 307 In 2006 he hit 326. in 2007 he hit 341 and 321 in 2008.
hes obviously better than swish in the field. a better base runner. holliday could steal bases too. he stole 28 in 2008.
he has hit .322, with a .452 on-base percentage, since May 12

and hes only going to get a 3 year deal for a lot less than what he would have made if he played well this year.

1 error compared to 4 errors.

i would rather have crawford too. but the rays have an option on him and he would probably stay with them.

by jeter751 on Jun 19, 2009 12:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

ugggh

stop with the superfical stats. by your logic Melky Cabrera’s a better player than Ryan Howard. because Melky hits for a better average!!!

Matt Holliday’s stats so far is a huge by product of Coors field. he’s still a good player .but not a GREAT one.

Just to note

Holliday career on the road.
282/.351/.455

at home
.349/.417/.628

Nick Swisher career on the road
250/.355/.457

So on the road for their career, Nick Swisher’s basically exactly the same as Holliday. Holliday have some advantage with speed sure. but its not like he’s a 50 base stealer. and as I’ve noted, he is highly unlikely to have ANY advantage in New Yankee stadium because he’s a righty pull hitter. where as Swisher is a switch hitter.

As for his length of deal, he is a Boras client. sure this year is going to water down his contract. but 3 year is still a highly optimistic projection. before this year he was talking about some crazy 7-8 year deal shit.

IF we could get him on a 3 or 4 year deal at sub 15M price, sure. why not? but I’m highly skeptical of that.

As for defense, I’m skeptical of this as well. error is a idotic way of measuring defense since it’s highly subjective, you could end up getting a error for running a mile and making a diving catch but have the ball rolling out of the glove but limit them to first base. where if on the same play you just let it roll all the way to the wall and mail it back in and let them run it into a inside the park home run. which was the better defensive play? but which one gets the error? Bobby Abreu didn’t make too many errrors last year. but he was a HORRIFIC OF last year , because he simply didn’t get to many balls to make errors on in the first place.

fangraphs UZR has Matt Holliday at +7.5 run for his career per 150 inning, that’s pretty good. Nick Swisher by the same measure is a career +6.3 in LF and +7.3 in RF. so they’re basically similar defensively as well, (Though Holliday’s been obviously better so far this year. but defense is a fickle thing too, where the measure can change during the course of the season just like hitting slumps and hot streaks)

by RollingWave on Jun 19, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nick Swisher is also a HORRIBLE baserunner!!!

by pedro316 on Jun 20, 2009 9:20 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Bottom line here

is Swisher makes about 1/3 of Holliday, for similar stats. He’s slumping a bit right now, but overall he’s really as good a hitter.

I know money really isn’t an object to the Yanks (and obviously fans who want him over Swisher), but Id much rather spend the money on a player who’s actually better than Swisher.

by FreeBradshaw on Jun 20, 2009 7:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It is not smart

for the Yanks to give up enough value to get Matt.

They have a lot of outfielders. Give Austin Jackson time to come join the maturing Melky and BG as a young, home grown outfield. They have Arod and Tex for a LONG time. When they add more stars they need to be Younger than those guys.

If I's known I was going to live so long, I'd have taken better care of myself. Casey

by Cbeck3 on Jun 21, 2009 10:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

true

i like that. i dont know if gardner is going to be a great player though. but i do like him a lot. that triple he got today was very clutch. hes good gardner and i love his speed. melky, i dont know about him. hes been great in the clutch but his skill set plays for a backup outfielder. hes a good fielder with a nice arm but his hitting is ok. he may just be in a polonged streak like he was last year until he sucked. i do feel that ajax will be a star for the yankees if he works on his power and strikeout count. but i like where ur going with this.

by jeter751 on Jun 21, 2009 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs