6 starting pitchers, 5 spots

by 3460kuri on Jun 1, 2009 11:40 AM EDT Comment 14 comments

Now that Chien-Ming Wang is off the disabled list, and seems to have remedied his early-season woes (and his phantom "injury"), the Yankees are in the pleasantly uncomfortable position of having 6 healthy, effective starting pitchers at the same time. I believe Hughes has earned his spot in the rotation (for now, at least) as has Joba. Despite some of their issues, they are clearly Major-League caliber starting pitchers.

Barring some sort of injury, that leaves Wang as the odd man out.

Considering that both Hughes and Joba have limits placed on their innings and pitch counts, and considering how poorly the bullpen has performed so far, I think it makes sense to make Wang the "6th man" of the starting rotation preparing to pitch 2-3 innings each time that Hughes or Joba is slated to start. With this arrangement, he would still log 100-110 innings for the remainder of the season. The bullpen would get a respite twice a week, and Wang would take innings from guys who ordinarily cause our hair to gray prematurely.

Obviously, once somebody gets injured, or Hughes/Joba struggle badly, the situation would change. But until that happens, I can't think of a single reason NOT to do this. Wang is durable enough to handle this type of workload, and seems amenable to helping the team in any way he can. If there's a way to see less of Jose Veras, Edwar Ramirez, and Jonathan Albaladejo, isn't it worth trying?

The AL East is extremely close; the third-place could easily post the third best record in baseball but miss the postseason entirely. Ultimately, the race will probably be decided by roster depth; no matter how unorthodox this may seem, it gives the Yankees an edge that the Red Sox, Rays, and Blue Jays don't currently have. Let's hope Cashman and Girardi see the light.

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Not so unorthodox

it is exactly how the Sox are using Justin Masterson right now. It is a luxury created by having depth in the rotation and pen, because lat year the Sox had to use Masterson as a late inning guy. In that regard, Wang could server several uses out of the pen, even if not as a long man to spell the younger kids.

The only issue I would have with it is what happens if Wang needs to be sloted, on short notice, back in the rotation. Would he have to be stretched out again (if this is a month or two away) or can he just go right back to pitching 5+ innings?

by Buzzy on Jun 1, 2009 12:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Id rather see Wang

get the start than the young guys… but we are not allowed to talk about Joba anymore.

by ryanwk628 on Jun 1, 2009 1:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I know the other guys have potential and Wang may have hit his ceiling, but back to back 19 win seasons is not a bad place to top out at. Remember, he started out as our ace last year.

by ryanwk628 on Jun 1, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Id say you'd have to put Wang back in the rotation

the past few seasons he’s been as consistent as any guy in the league. If he’s back to normal there’s no reason to have him in the pen.

Id say the only pitcher that has his rotation spot in check is Hughes. He’s really been the most inconsistent.

The only thing is do the Yanks send him down, or maybe they put him in the pen.

It may be on a start by start basis. Hughes didn’t pitch horrendously, but still he is the top candidate right now to at least get his next start skipped in favor of Wang.

by FreeBradshaw on Jun 1, 2009 1:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hughes

His ERA is kind of misleading, but if you take away his horrendous start against Baltimore (1.2 IP, 8 ER), he’s got an ERA of about 3.50, with a strikeout per inning and 2:1 K/BB ratio. That’s really not shabby.

I think the only reason you put Wang in this role is because he’s older and more durable, with less of a risk of arm injury.

by 3460kuri on Jun 1, 2009 1:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Or...

Because Wang’s been a Cy Young candidate every year he’s stayed healthy. Back to back 19 win seasons isnt a fluke. He’s either a shaky ace or an excellent #2 pitcher, so why isnt he starting? He’s back from the ‘injury’ and proved at least to me that he’s got his stuff back the sinker looks great most of the time. The dream rotation was supposed to be CC Wang Burnett Pettitte Joba/Hughes. Wang’s earned his spot. Send….. you know…

by Jon F on Jun 1, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

dont say it

that discussion is so “old”

by ryanwk628 on Jun 1, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not even a question

Wang gets the spot. Hughes goes down to Scranton to get ready for his Sept call up. Wang and Hughes aren’t even in the same league. Two 19 win seasons in a row (Only Halladay, of the current crop of relatively young Aces in MLB have that claim to fame), and was well on his way to another 18+ win season until he got injured last season. Hughes has looked inconsistent. He will be our replacement for Pettite next season but right now his best contribution is a spot starter till Wang is 100% and to get some serious innings in AAA until the playoffs.

by HappyLuckyGoldenDragonNumber1! on Jun 1, 2009 4:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

But here is the thing

Throw baseball orthodoxy out the window for a moment.

The fifth starter, whomever he is, will probably pitch 100 more innings for the remainder of the season. We have two pitchers capable of doing this, and doing it well.

So in a close pennant race, aren’t the Yankees going to be better off with 200 innings from Wang and Hughes, rather than 200 innings from Wang, Albaladejo, Tomko, and Veras (and 75 from Hughes in AAA)?

I understand this upsets the “natural order” but it’s a pennant race. The Yankees have the good fortune of having six healthy, effective starting pitchers at the same time. Why NOT take advantage?

by 3460kuri on Jun 1, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Why not:

Because using Joba or Phil in the bullpen will not help their development as starting pitchers. These guys are the future of our pitching staff, and we don’t need to delay either of their development by using them as relievers.

What the Yankees need to do is put Wang back in the rotation, because when he’s healthy he’s our second best starter. Joba needs to be kept a starter until the playoffs, where he can then be used for relief work since you only carry 4 starters in the playoffs. Phil needs to be sent back to AAA to continue developing, because he’s going to be in the starting rotation next year when they don’t resign Pettitte.

by Wraithpk on Jun 2, 2009 1:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It's a head-scratcher

But I think you have to live in the present. Wang’s ineffectiveness set this chain of events in motion, and now the Yankees are getting consistent starting pitching and playing great baseball.

Wang looks to be adaptable to his “new” role whether it be for the short-term or the long-term, and he’s helping the team.

The initial post said it best that the Yankees are in a “pleasantly uncomfortable position” but it’s a long season and things change often. This same situation may develop in the OF when X-Nady returns.

by BacktimeTV on Jun 2, 2009 11:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hughes needs to go back to Scranton

Sorry, Phil. He’s been miles better this year than last, but he’s the odd man out.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Jun 2, 2009 11:05 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Until Wang has another rough start right?

Having 6 good SP’s is a problem most managers would love to have guys. We are winning ball games and are in first place, Girardi should do exactly what hes been doing, keep Phil in the rotation. Somebody will get hurt and then what we call Hughes back up, let him keep pitching, leave Wang in the pen.

Wang will get his chance again, be patient fellas.

by jsballer3314 on Jun 3, 2009 8:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

no problem with Wang

in the pen as long as Phil and Joba are pitching well. it’s a nice luxury.

he put himself in this position. and please dont go overboard: he’s pitched 5 scoreless relief innings. ok, that’s nice. you’d think he’d just pitched consecutive no-hitters the way people are ready to put him back in the rotation.

by Travis G on Jun 3, 2009 12:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs