Topics that are Hereafter Forbidden on Pinstripe Alley
by Wraithpk on Dec 5, 2009 5:58 PM EST
45 comments
Here is a nice list of things that have been beaten to death as badly as Adrian Beltre's right testicle. Please refrain from bringing them up again. Feel free to add more in the comments if I missed any.
1. Anything that involves Vernon Wells being on the Yankees with his ridiculous contract.
2. Any suggestion of signing Rick Ankiel to be our starting CF, unless you can personally get him a therapeutic use exemption for HGH.
3. Your brilliant suggestion of trading Shelley Duncan and Jeter's jockstrap for Sizemore, or Granderson, or Lincecum, or (insert young All-Star making next to nothing here).
4. Your idea to move A-Rod to Catcher and have Jeter pitch every 5th day.
5. Any assertion that Halladay sitting in the dugout will magically make AJ pitch better without supporting it with facts and statistics. (I know a lot of you like to say that, but look at his career stats. It does not show that)
6. Any sentence that has the both the words "trade" and "Montero" in it. Unless, of course, the word "not" is also in that sentence.
7. All suggestions of permanently moving Joba and/or Hughes to the pen before we know for sure that they can't have a good career as a starter.
8. Trading for Roy Halladay. If you even think of violating rule number 6 to get this trade done, you should be forced to go hunting with Dick Cheney. It's a horrible idea unless we give up unimportant prospects and know we can sign him to an extension.
Thank you, that is all for now.
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Thank you!!!
I agree with all of them. Particularly #6. DO NOT TRADE MONTERO!!!!
I’ve got something to add. Anything that says, “Gardner will be our starting CF”.
HE IS A FOURTH OUTFIELDER!!!!! NOTHING MORE!!!!!
see, I kinda disagree on this.
Is he the long term solution? Probably not. But let’s be honest, CF is not a position known for great hitters. It’s a defensive position, and in that area, Gardner is one of the best in the league with his speed. Sure, he could work on his hitting and arm strength, but he’s still young, and we really just need someone to hold the fort down until AJAX is ready. Personally I think Gardner is a better everyday player than Melky.
Well, we'll have to agree to disagree on that
but I don’t think that if Gardner plays every day, that he is capable of hitting even .240 in the big leagues. He’s an average hitter against bad pitching. Put him up against good pitching and he’s lost. Look at him in the World Series. Yes, he can run. Yes, he can play defense. Thats why I think he’s a fourth outfielder. But if he plays everyday, I just don’t trust his bat. Melky had a good year in 2007, and a good year in 2009. He was an important player for the Yankees in 2009. He’s a great defender (although not to Gardner’s ability), he can run (again, not to Gardners ability), he has a cannon for an arm, he has some pop. and he has proved that he can hit .270 in the majors at least. To me, I’d much rather have Melky than GGBG starting every day.
I agree that they are just holding down the fort until AJAX is ready. Gardner isn’t exactly “young” either. He’s not a baby. He’s 26 years old I think (1 year older than Melky). And last year was only his first full season in the majors
I think the best option is splitting time between Gardner and Melky like they did last year. I don’t think either are a viable everyday option, but they seem to do better when they split playing time.
I agree
thats probably what they will do. Just play the hot hand. That gives you the best production out of the spot. I think that if you had to choose one, I would choose Melky. But the Yankees don’t have to choose one, do they? Split the time, play the hot hand. Thats probably the best thing they could do.
I wish AJAX would hurry up. I want to see him play!!!!!! He just needs to strike out less. If he could hit more HR that would be nice, but if he K’s less, then he’ll be in the bigs.
Can we also please add
(Joba/Hughes) belongs in da pen yo! Look at hiz stats and hiz wickid fast fastball when he onli pitches wun inning!!!
This sticker is dangerous and inconvenient, but I do love Fig Newtons.
Oh I get it!
You make the straw man with the opposing view point speak as an illiterate so that you can feel smarter. That’s so clever! You know who else is great pitching one inning? That Mariano Rivera guy! Only an idiot wouldn’t make Rivera a starter after seeing what he can do in one inning! I wish the Steinbrenner sons had been the owners back when Mariano was starting out. Think how many more great innings we would have gotten out of him. And the years that we were champs? With Mariano starting, they would have declared us SUPER ULTRA champs. Only an idiot would disagree with this.
Mariano was a starter until he was 26
then was moved to the bullpen after he proved he could not be a good starting pitcher.
Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.
Mariano as starter
I don’t think he “proved” he couldn;t be a starting pitcher. He made 10 career major league starts and he was a dominant starter in the minors. I think if Mariano had been left as a starter he would have been good, but being as little as he is, he definitely wouldn’t be at the top of his game at age 40 like he is now. Also the Yankees weren’t thrilled with Wetteland and they knew they’d be letting him go after 96, which opened up the closer role for Mariano. It’s a different story with Joba. He’s a big guy so long term durability shouldn’t be an issue and the Yankees don’t need a closer. Mariano still being at the top of his gave gives them the opportunity to find out what Joba can be as a starter before deciding his ultimate role.
by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Dec 6, 2009 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
They didn’t think Mo could start long-term because his only great pitch was his cutter. His slider was never great, and his change-up was also not great.
I could be mistaken...
but didn’t Mo discover the cutter by accident AFTER he had already moved to the bullpen? So he didn’t actually have the cutter as a starter. Just saying.
I don't care if you make the argument that they belong in the pen
just don’t do it like that. More than half of the time when someone is suggesting Joba to the pen, it’s done very very poorly. If you’ve got a real argument, fine.
This sticker is dangerous and inconvenient, but I do love Fig Newtons.
Does this mean that you would not deal
(notice I didn’t say “trade”) Montero straight up for Halladay?
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Dec 5, 2009 8:24 PM EST reply actions
I think that goes under #4
4) should be renamed to fantasy land.
I don’t think anyone here would attest to that trade…..except for the Blue Jays.
That’s just not gonna happen so, like the reason for most of this “banned” list…The hell is the point?
"It ain't over till its over"---
If Jesus is indeed
the second coming, why wouldn’t the Jays take him, plus send a bucket of cash to the Yankees for the honor of us taking Halladay and parting with Jesus?
FYI, I was being sarcastic.
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Dec 5, 2009 8:49 PM EST up reply actions
Playing devil's advocate
Guess who these #s belong to:
17 seasons: 462 HRs, .266 BA, .867 OPS, .515 SLG.
Any idea who those #s belong to?
Jose Canseco. Guy could rake. Was with Oakland for 9 years, then 6 other teams for the other 8 years. Pure hitter, with average defensive skills.
Would I rather have Canseco in his prime or Halladay a year or two past his? I go with pitching. Even if Montero realizes his potential, which is still a big IF, Montero and Joba for Halladay is still a reasonable topic for discussion, no matter how loudly the the Jesus is God contingent trumpets their man.
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Dec 5, 2009 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
The thing is..
The Yankees have an ace. They have a #2 and a slew of young pitching possibly on the way.
Do they have other catchers too? Yes. Do they have the one with the potential to be Montero’s jock strap? No, not even the cup (and that’s in no way a knock to Romine et. al)
Canseco is also not a catcher.
Getting that sort of production from a catcher….gives you a rare advantage.
…..and Montero + Joba is fantasy land too….Toronto would be nuts to leave it at that.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Dec 5, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Probability theory
requires multiplying events that occur together. So if Joba becoming # 1 or # 2 starter has a 1/3 chance of happening, and Montero becoming a starter for the Yankees has a 1/2 chance of happening, and unnamed prospect has a 1/5 chance of becoming a starter for the Yankees, then the odds that all three of those events occurring is 1/3 X 1/2 X 1/5 or 1/30, or .033.
Let’s say in each season Halladay is with the Yanks, the odds that he wins at least 15 games are 3/4. Over four seasons, the chances that he will win 15 or more games each season are 81/256, or .316.
Notice that the odds Halladay wins 15 games/season over 4 seasons for the Yankees are greater than the odds that any two of the other three events occurs (1/6, 1/10 or 1/15) and roughly equal to the odds that one of the other three events occurs alone.
Montero is a hitter. His defense has to improve; otherwise, he could well follow the career path of pure hitters before him, i.e., remain with one club while he is cost-controlled, then shuffle between other clubs for one or two year stints as a DH.
My humble opinion on the farm system is that the Yankees should focus on cultivating up-the-middle players: catcher, pitcher, SS, 2B and CF. The rest of the team can be acquired. So the big question is whether Montero really sticks as a catcher. I put the odds there much lower. Now if he were a SS, I’d have a different opinion. But Romine’s got better odds of becoming the starting catcher than Montero.
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Dec 6, 2009 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
Its a risk/reward thing
Say the Yankees trade Montero + either Joba or Hughes + a bunch of lesser prospects for Halladay. What are they getting? Probably 5-6 years of Halladay. Its fair to say that he’s got 2-3 elite type years left in him and probably a couple more decent to good years. However, Halladay only has 1 year left on his deal and the 2010 FA pitching class is strong so the Yankees would most likely be able to sign Halladay or another excellent pitcher if they needed to. So really what you’re trading for is Halladay in 2010 + the inside track on negotiating an extension with him.
Now what are they giving up? Montero’s 20. If he turns into what people say he will the Yankees would be giving up 6 relatively inexpensive years of a Miguel Cabrera-type hitter plus whatever years they signed him for after that. They’d also be giving up Joba or Hughes who, at worst, should be #3 type major league starters or future closers.
Of course there’s a risk that prospects will turn into busts, but I think the regret of giving up on kids who turn into stars is worse than the regret of “we didn’t trade for Roy Halladay but signed Cliff Lee a year later.”
by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Dec 6, 2009 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
We should know what we have in Montero for sure this coming year. He’s expected to make his way to AAA quickly, if he doesn’t start the season there. If he’s hitting .300-.330 in AAA with power, he’s very unlikely to become a bust in the majors. He’ll probably take a year or two to adjust to major league pitchers, but he should be special
6) proff enough for me. 'llI take the word of AJ's over anyone on this blog:
http://www.nj.com/yankees/index.ssf/2009/05/roy_halladay_credits_aj_burnet.html
From NY daily news
Halladay was a mentor of sorts to the Yankees’ A.J. Burnett when the two were teammates in Toronto, and Burnett has given Halladay credit for helping him mature as a pitcher.
Yes..
AJ was a younger dude then and was 10x as much of a wild spirit than he is now.
Halladay was the one who told him not to throw 100mph on every pitch.
If AJ needs Halladay to mentor him now…we should’ve never signed Burnett.
AJ fails as a human if he still needs Halladay to mentor him.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Can I add something?
AJAX…
Seriously…it’s like this guy is already starting and has done something amazing in the majors if I didn’t know otherwise just based on some of these posts on here…
Who is over hyping him?
People saying that he should be ready by the middle of next season?
Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.
over-hyping...
may be what we all do with Montero, tho I don’t really see that, he’s one of the top 3 hitting prospects in the game, by those who rate prospects.
You wanna see overhyping, head over to Over the Monster.
Observe the daily felating of their minor league system they do over there.
"It ain't over till its over"---
With all prospects
We have to remind ourselves that nobody’s a sure thing and that there are a million things that can happen to derail a guy’s career. I think all teams’ fans get excited about the prospects though, especially when you have a guy like Montero dominating leagues where most of the players are 3 years older than him.
by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Dec 7, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
Here's to hoping
that neither AJax nor Montero gets stab in a barfight.
by Scooby Snacks on Dec 7, 2009 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
Giving Melky and Gardner 500 ABs each.
That’s dumber than anything you wrote.
by New York Sports Jerk on Dec 8, 2009 11:25 AM EST reply actions
its sad...
but they’ve been.
Luckily, Curtis GRAND SLAM SON! is on the squad, so Gardner can get ass-cheek splinters.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Please add...
Ajax will be missed… some of you treat and talk about this kid like some sort of kiddy baseball porn. Majority of you have only seen him take swings on youtube. Good luck to him, but please Ajax was not the next yankee captain.
don't dismiss him like that.
I dunno where you get the porn from (I think you should’ve paused that…..), but I know I’ve seen actual games of him playing. Seemed legit to me.
The only thing people don’t realize is that while we all would’ve like AJAX to be patrolling CF for the Yanks till 2020, the reality is he’s a prospect always in danger for this. Especially since he’s not a A++ level one like a Montero, or even one like Hughes or Joba.
Also, we had this guy named CJ Henry? Remember him? He was a SS but could’ve got switched to OF cuz of El Capitan at SS.
Traded him for Bobby Abreu.
How’d that work out? Bobby was an RBI machine for the Yanks. CJ Henry never made it and now is back to playing basketball with his all-world younger brother Xavier Henry.
And you don’t know what he would’ve become. Dude could’ve become what Granderson was to Detroit.
"It ain't over till its over"---
No offense
but the Yankees made you eat #3 by trading not Shelly Duncan but Ajax and IPK for Granderson.
Also, according to MLB trade rumors, the Blue Jays themselves have told the Yankees that they would want Montero + Hughes or Joba + someone else for Halladay. So, even if no one here goes there, and Cashman makes that deal, the words Halladay, Montero, and trade will all be in the same sentence.
I’m not saying one way or another about what I think should happen, but let’s accept the reality that Cashman will do whatever he deems fit to do to put a team on the field that will bring the first back to back WS Champions since we last did it in 1999/2000.
In all fairness, we should be able to discuss, within reason, any deal that we think may or may not happen in addition to what we think of the trades/acquisitions that do happen. Again, within reason. And it is within reason, even though some of us here at PA don’t agree, that Cashman may be willing to give up our favorite minor leaguers to get talent that we KNOW will produce now. Whether that be Halladay or Mauer next off season, or whatever.
My opinion is that we’d be fine acquiring Sheets and some other reclamation pitchers to fill out our rotation and/or bullpen spots. Probably not Chapman. Plus, who knows, maybe Robertson gets a chance to be a big leaguer next season and is a diamond in the rough for us.
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