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Around SBN: Nevin Shapiro Vows To Bring Down Miami

I can has Left Fielder?



So, we need a Left Fielder.  So many choices, so little time, so much money (thanks popa George!).  Let's take a statistical and financial look at our choices.

1.  Put Gardner in center, and Melky in left.  I have a feeling Gardner is going to win the CF job anyway, so the debate is Melky in Left, or as our 4th OF if we sign someone else.

cost:  $1.4M (what we payed him last year.  This isn't extra salary, though, since he'll be on the team either way)

production:  4 year averages:  wOBA: .316,  UZR/150: -.9,  WAR: .975. 

This is obviously the cheap option.  We would only win 1 more game over a replacement-level player.  Pros:  Melky is young and durable, and could get better.  He also wouldn't cost us anything extra.  Cons:  This would make our outfield offense pretty weak.  We need more production from the corner outfielders.  Melky's 1 WAR is worth 2.2M, so we would actually be underpaying him by .8M.

2.  Resign Damon.

cost:  9-12M (based on rumors of what they will ask for)

production:   wOBA: .363,  UZR/150: -4.8,  WAR:  2.925

Option 2 is an offense upgrade over option 1, but a defensive downgrade.  Overall, Damon in left nets us 2 more wins on the season, which with the conversion of 1 WAR = 2.2M, puts his suggested salary at 4.4M above Melky.  Since Melky is still under team control, he doesn't make what he's worth, which means we would overpay for those 2 wins by 4-6M.

3.  Sign Jason Bay.

cost:  16-18M (also based on rumors)

production:  wOBA: .398,  UZR/150: -7.7,  WAR:  4.575

For Bay, I omitted his 2007 season because he was injured, which clearly effected his play that year.  His career suggests those numbers were a fluke.  So, Bay is an upgrade over Damon offensively, but a big downgrade defensively.  Overall, he is worth about 1.5 wins more than Damon, which is worth 3.3M in salary, putting his worth at 7.7M more than Melky.  His worth is about 10.5M, so we would overpay for his 3.5 wins over Melky by 5.5-7.5M.

4.  Sign Matt Holliday.

cost: 18-22M (based on the fact that he turned down 16M from the Cards, and would probably have a similar contract to Teixeira if we were to sign him)

production:  wOBA: .411,  UZR/150:  6.5,  WAR:  6.05.

Holliday is a good offensive upgrade over Bay, and a HUGE defensive upgrade.  While Bay has been one of the worst outfielders in the game the past 4 years, Holliday has been one of the better ones.  Holliday would cost 2-4M more than Bay, and his 1.5 more wins puts his value at 3.3M more, which is within that range.  Overall, Holliday's worth is about 14M, so we would overpay for his 6 wins by about 4-8M.

Economical values:

Melky: 1.4M / win

Damon: 3.07 - 4.1M / win

Bay:  3.5 - 3.9M / win

Holliday:  3 - 3.6M / win

Conclusions:

I think it's a foregone conclusion that Melky will not be the starting Left Fielder, the Yankees are going to get someone.  Of the top 3 candidates, Damon is the cheapest, but also the least effective.  Along with that, he's 37 years old, so he will most likely perform worse than his 4 year averages.  Holliday and Bay, on the other hand, are 29 and 31, respectively, so we could sign either to a longer deal without much fear of decline soon.  Holliday would be the most expensive, but would provide us 3 more wins for the season over Damon, which in the AL East can be the difference between winning the division and not making the playoffs.  I think it's pretty evident that Bay is not the best choice.  We would pay him almost as much as Holliday, but he's not as good of a player.  In terms of what we're getting for what we're paying for, Holliday is actually the best value.  So my suggestion, save the 18 - 24M it would cost to resign both Damon and Matsui, and use that money for Holliday.  That frees up the DH spot for Posada and the other starters when they need a little rest, and gives us Teixeira, A-Rod, and Holliday for our 3-4-5 spots.  That would be the most devastating 3-4-5 combo in baseball by far.

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Well

I agre with this logic to a point.

I think we shoould sign someone excellent. So, Bay or Holiday is the choice. I
 think we should pursue both and see what happens in the FA market.

I would be quite happy with Bay.

"You don't realize how easy this game is until you get up in that broadcasting booth." Mickey

by Cbeck3 on Nov 17, 2009 2:05 PM EST reply actions  

What leads you to

feel that Gardner would win the CF job rather than they platoon Melky and Gardner again?

Not saying I disagree with you, just wondering why you think that.

I don’t really like any of the options you presented. I’d actually like to see them get a quality CF and a quality LF, both with offensive numbers better than Melky or Gardner. I’m not sure Damon is worth it, with him being in the twilight of a career that saw him never being great defensively but worth his salt at the plate.

I’m really just hoping that Cashman makes another deal like he did with Swisher and bring in another quality player who is also good for the clubhouse.

by phonty on Nov 17, 2009 2:45 PM EST reply actions  

I think they will still platoon...

but I feel like Gardner will get more action this year than he did last. He performed almost equally to Melky last year, which was only his second season in the bigs, and first full season. If he continues to improve he will pass Melky soon.

by Wraithpk on Nov 17, 2009 3:40 PM EST up reply actions  

A few corner outfield trade options

Brad Hawpe – Not sure what Colorado would want for him, but his .890 OPS away from Coors in 2009 wasn’t much less than Jason Bay’s .904 OPS away from Fenway and he wouldn’t require a long-term commitment.

Magglio Ordonez – Huge salary in 2010 but it is just for 1 year. After an awful start he put up a .978 OPS in the 2nd half of 09, and he could be had for pretty much nothing.

Carlos Lee – Another guy who could be had for very little. He’s still productive but signed through 2012 (age 36) at 18.5 mil a year so I’d pass.

by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Nov 17, 2009 3:30 PM EST reply actions  

Hawpe would be nice.

The others? Too much money for declining players. Might as well overpay for 2 years of Damon, at least you know he can handle NY.

"It ain't over till its over"---

by FreeBradshaw on Nov 17, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Either Damon or

Holliday. I think that’s really it.

I don’t like Bay, he’s a bad OF (probably better than Damon tho, cuz that stupid wall made him look bad out there…)

I’d really hate to see the OF have Gardner and Melky starting. Combined on a day where they have to sit Posada or DH him?…..yea, Melky, Gardner AND Cervelli (or even Molina…). That’s shit. 3 below average hitters? In a row?

Unless there’s something by trade, I think its either Damon or Holliday. I’d make both of them an offer now, just in case Holliday signs (cuz Holliday >> Damon).

Cuz if Holliday signs somewhere else quick, Damon’s price will go up (..and Boras probably knows this anyway…so its pretty moot.).

"It ain't over till its over"---

by FreeBradshaw on Nov 17, 2009 4:00 PM EST reply actions  

Holliday

in my mind is the only worthwhile choice. If we sign him to a longer deal you can usually get a discount on total price, so we might be able to get him for a couple million less per year than Teixeira got. With Tex, A-Rod, and him in the heart of our lineup for the next 7 years, we will be dominant offensively for a long time.

by Wraithpk on Nov 17, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions  

If Po is DHing...

Who’s our catcher going to be? You guys seem to want to get rid of Mat just so Po can DH, but who’s going to replace him as catcher? Cervelli? Molina?

Please don’t tell me it’s going to be one of these minor league kids…

by jigglytuffy on Nov 17, 2009 4:40 PM EST reply actions  

Posada...

can’t catch everyday. He’s getting older and needs some breaks from squatting behind the plate, so we’ll need a backup catcher anyway. Cervelli would be a fine backup until Romine or Montero are ready.

by Wraithpk on Nov 17, 2009 5:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Cervelli can back up for all of next year

Then he can split C duties while breaking in Montero in 2011.

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Nov 17, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions  

And by he I mean Posada.

In 2011 Montero and Posada can split DH/C duties. Then in 2012 Romine will probably be close to ready.

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Nov 17, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I laughed out loud when I read the title to this post.

That said, I am of the crowd who believes we should sign Holliday. Now, I understand there are piles of reasons either for or against this belief, but I stand strong. One school of thought is to resign Damon for a year or two until Austin Jackson is ready and can take over in either left or center. Now, I’m all about Damon’s bat, it’s been excellent for us, especially at the top of the order. However, between 2005, 06, and 07, his WAR was between 2 and 3 (2.2, 2.8, and 2.3 respectively). The last two years though, it has been 3.6 in ‘08 and 3.0 in ’09. Had he played even average defense in LF, he would have been worth another full win, pushing it to 4.0. To say his past two years were career years wouldn’t be a huge stretch of the imagination.
If you look specifically at park-adjusted batting runs above replacement and leave out fielding, his past two years: 23.1 in ‘08 and 25.3 in ’09 were his highest of his career save his 2004 season with the Red Sox. This strengthens the case that he has had two back to back career years. Now, I’m not predicting he’ll be lousy next year if we resign him, but if it’s even a two year deal worth $12 or $13MM, we may be overpaying (drastically) for him.
Granted, Matt Holliday has had his WAR totals decrease each of the past 3 seasons, but he was still able to but up 5.7 WAR this past year despite having an awful first half and playing in The Polo Grounds The Coliseum. If we sign him for 5 or 6 years, it wouldn’t be unrealistic to expect WAR totals of 5 the first 3 years followed by a drop off to 3 towards the end of the deal.

by Leviticus6688 on Nov 17, 2009 6:50 PM EST reply actions  

Thank you for being the only person to get the title.

Yeah, I think Holliday is the best choice. The only question is how much does Cashman want to spend on free agents this year? Really, all we need is to resign Pettitte, and pick up Holliday. We can use Melky to DH and put Gardner in center when we aren’t using the DH for Posada or one of the other starters.

by Wraithpk on Nov 17, 2009 10:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Front Office Cat is watching you put together an outfield...

"Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat." - Theodore Roosevelt

by Daniel52 on Nov 17, 2009 11:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Brian Cashman cat says:

“I’m in ur farm sistemz, scowtin ur playerz u won’t b able 2 sine wen thay r free agent eligibal.”

by Wraithpk on Nov 19, 2009 7:30 PM EST reply actions  

what about figgins?

signing Figgins to play LF would be a similar contract to damon’s but to a much younger player it makes more sense. he would be a great improvement defensively, steals 40-50 bases a year, hits .300 and scores 100 runs a year. plus he could play third on those days off that a-rod is going to need. more speed in front of arod and tex could be really valuable

by BronxBeliever on Nov 20, 2009 8:26 PM EST reply actions  

I wouldn't mind having Figgins on the team...

but he hasn’t played the OF regularly since 2006, and he wasn’t very good at it then. Plus you usually want a hitter with more power playing the corner outfield position.

by Wraithpk on Nov 20, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions  

It wouldn't be a similar contract to Damon's

Everything I’ve read so far is that Figgins can expect a contract similar to Juan Pierre’s 5/55 which is about 3 years and 45 million more than that type of player’s worth. I know he’s scrappy and irritating when we play against him but I just don’t think a speed/no power guy is that valuable.

by Let's Talk About Tex Baby on Nov 21, 2009 2:36 AM EST up reply actions  

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