Has everyone forgot Ben Sheets?

by YanksFan14 on Jan 8, 2009 1:07 AM EST Comment 25 comments

I know what everyone is going to say, Ben Sheets is an injury risk. I agree he gets hurt every season but when he is healthy he is very very good. He started 31 games last year and in the last two years he record is 25-14. Last year he had a 3.09 era and even started the All Star for the national league last year. Why not offer a two year deal for the same $10 million a season offered to Andy Pettite. This contract can be built around incentives based on starts because of his frequent injuries. A rotation of CC, Wang, Burnett, Sheets, Joba would be the formula to a World Series in my opinion. If one gets hurt you can fill their slot with Hughes or some other younger pitcher needing experience.

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thats what i have been saying this whole time yanksfan14!!! we have the money to do it and why not put a gamble on an ace that is going to be our 4 starter?

by jv52yankees on Jan 8, 2009 1:41 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

There's gotta be something we all don't know

No one seems to be biting on Sheets, at least not with Lowe still on the market. I don’t think an injury risk is something we need. We already have Burnett, and Wang is coming off an injury (not to mention those of Posada’s shoulder, Damon’s nagging foot, Jeter’s knees and wrist, and of course, Matsui’s knees), and Joba was injured for a few weeks last year. If we’re going to get another free-agent pitcher, it has to be on a one- or two-year deal, which Sheets would satisfy, and someone who we can almost guarantee will pitch 200+ quality innings. As I said in another thread, if we want to gamble on a rotation slot, we can do it with cheaper, younger, promising pitchers from our system who we need to give innings to anyway so they can develop into our rotation of the future.

"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden

by SenorSwanky on Jan 8, 2009 2:58 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

It could be even simpler

in a market where one injury risk got a 5 year deal (AJ), Sheets and/or his agents could be mistakenly setting the bar at 3 years or at a price tag closer to AJ’s 16 million.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Jan 8, 2009 6:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sheets ...

I’d give him $10m for a season—but only if he threw 200innings. I really wouldn’t even put any other incentives in place. I think the guy, while certainly risky is dominant. I watched him toss a two-hitter a couple of years back. I think he struck out 13—most looking. That’s domination.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Jan 8, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i agree

and i think that will be the rotation when the season starts. cash is playing this close to the vest

by bkcowboy on Jan 8, 2009 10:20 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

if's

IF we sign another SP it pretty much pushes Joba back into the pen which isn’t a bad thing, but I think they’re pretty sold on Joba as a starter as am I…BUT not to the exclusion of Hughes being a starter. I makes no sense to go get another SP and push Hughes out of the #5 spot. Especially when Coke, Aceves and IPK will be pushing him hard at #5 anyhow. A concern about Joba’s innings will be the biggest factor of signing another SP which would effectively push him into the pen. At that point between Hughes/ IPK and the rest the innings at #5 should be covered.

Injuries are injuries they happen to everyone and there is NO way to plan for any of them. If CC goes down does that eliminate us from payoff contention…the Yanks did pretty well when Wang went down last year despite not making the playoffs, they pushed the whole way…Boston and Tampa never felt comfortable the whole year.

We’re in good shape and YES depth helps and YES adding Sheets or Perez would give us more depth. But DO it IF the chemistry makes sense at this point, don’t do moves out of fear of injuries.

by tozer55 on Jan 8, 2009 11:25 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Joba will be a starter to the exclusion of Hughes, if need be

Joba in the #5 spot is set in stone. Hughes is less ready to pitch in the majors by any standard (innings, stuff, etc.). His innings cap is about 30 fewer than Joba’s, so even in the #5 spot, a good chunk of that spot’s starts would have to be made by another starter or starters.

Why would Hughes push Joba into the pen? What is this concern about his innings? He’ll pitch 130-140 innings to Hughes’ 100 or so.

Also, adding Perez would only give us crappiness.

"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden

by SenorSwanky on Jan 8, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hughes....

having a lower innings cap than Joba…

by daneptizl on Jan 10, 2009 12:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You really

think he’ll only pitch 100…

by daneptizl on Jan 10, 2009 12:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, I misspoke

I forgot that Hughes pitched 30 innings in a winter league, so he ended up pitching 99.2 total in 2008. So he could conceivably pitch up to 130 innings in 2009, which would be equal to or slightly lower than Joba’s cap. But, still, the idea that Hughes would push Joba into the pen is the most stupidly laughable thing I’ve read in some time—well, at least almost as much as Pavano’s comments today.

"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden

by SenorSwanky on Jan 10, 2009 4:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

becasue he's dominant in the pen

and he’ll end up the Rivera to Wetteland

by tozer55 on Jan 10, 2009 12:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Eyeroll

Some people never learn.

"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden

by SenorSwanky on Jan 10, 2009 4:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Uhm...CC would probably be dominant in the pen too

but I don’t see anyone clamoring to get him in there.

Everything looks nicer when you win. The girls are prettier. The cigars taste better. The trees are greener. --Billy Martin

by garp on Jan 10, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Why not make the offer

If Lowe is the best pitcher still on the market and the Mets have only offered $12 mill then Sheets can’t expect more then that. If the Yankees were willing to give $10 mill to Andy who is 36 and coming off shoulder problems why not offer Ben Sheets who is 30 with injury problems the same money. I think the risk to reward is much better in the case of Sheets vs. Andy

by YanksFan14 on Jan 8, 2009 5:14 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

How many injury risks can the Yankee's sign?

At this point, Lowe has to be more attractive than Sheets solely because of his durability. Lowe will probably be a 4.25 ERA pitcher in the AL and Sheets would probably be a 3.50. The only question is how many starts will Sheets make?

by ruffolo2002 on Jan 10, 2009 4:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

But we'll never sign Lowe now

We apparently wanted him instead of Burnett, but according to Peter Gammons, Burnett’s agents got to us first. But we can’t sign Lowe now because of his contract demands (four years at 15-16 per), which would both be too expensive and too many years to commit when we need to get our own youngsters into the rotation.

"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden

by SenorSwanky on Jan 10, 2009 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Gammons is such a prick.

He makes it out like burnetts agents tricked the yankees into signing the guy they didn’t want. You gotta take everything he says with a grain of salt.

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Jan 10, 2009 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Andy vs. Sheets

The reason I started this post was to compare Pettite vs. Sheets. Andy is an injury risk and so is Sheets. If the Yankes were willing to give $10 mill to Andy then I said why not Sheets instead. If they both may get injured why not give the money to a guy with a higher upside. Pettite will never be as dominant as Sheets and Sheets started 31 games last year vs. Pettite starting 33. I would just rather give the money to Sheets instead of Pettite because of the higher reward.

by YanksFan14 on Jan 11, 2009 2:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Pettitte is not an injury risk

In Pettitte’s 14 major league seasons, he has thrown at least 175 IP twelve times and at least 200 IP ten times, including each of his last four seasons.

Sheets isn’t on the same planet as Pettitte in durability.

The higher reward isn’t worth the gamble if Sheets isn’t healthy enough to take the mound. And they’ve already got a high risk / high reward guy in Burnett. Way too risky to have more than one.

What they need now is a guy who is a good bet to give them 200 IP next season to stabilize the back end of that rotation.

Pettitte fits that criteria – Sheets doesn’t.

by anaconda on Jan 11, 2009 3:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Injury Risk

You are right about Pettites past but last season he went on the DL for back spasms and was also day to day a few time for the same problem. He then missed the end of the season along with some other games due to shoulder problems. It seems as if he is in a decline stuff wise and injury wise. He is 36 and how much more does he really have left. Sheets is 30 and in my opinion is worth the risk. If healthy he could be a number 1 pitcher on any team in Major League Baseball.

by YanksFan14 on Jan 11, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Re:

Pettitte did not spend any time on the DL last season. His shoulder issue required rest, but he kept pitching with it.

Any player like Pettitte who is getting older tends to be more susceptible to injuries, but it’s tough to make the argument that Sheets is a viable alternative when he’s been a walking Emergency Room since 2004.

Sheets cannot help them if he’s not healthy enough to take the mound. I’ll take 200 IP from Pettitte over 100 IP of Sheets.

If you roll the dice often enough, sooner or later you’ll lose your house.

Nobody questions Sheets’ ability on the mound. But teams are running scared after checking out his medical records. Pitchers of his talent don’t stay unemployed without a legitimate reason.

by anaconda on Jan 11, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

DL

Pettite was placed on the 15 day DL March 29, 2008, then missed games in September although he was not placed on the DL.

by YanksFan14 on Jan 11, 2009 7:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Re:

Pettitte made his first start of the season on April 5th against TB, so he didn’t miss any time. He also made four starts in September.

http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/individual_player_gamebygamelog.jsp?playerID=120485&statType=2

Dude, this is a losing argument for you. Trying to compare the durability of Pettitte and Sheets is like comparing the hotness of Megan Fox and Rosie O’Donnell.

If you are going to be so nit-picky on one guy, you should hold the same standard to both.

by anaconda on Jan 11, 2009 8:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Re

I agree and did not mean for my arguement to sound like Sheets is more durable. My opinion is that because of his age and recent injuries I would rather give the money to Sheets who in my view has the higher ceiling. I am though just a fan and not Brian Cashman so in the end we will see what happens.

by YanksFan14 on Jan 11, 2009 10:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The Latest?

Anybody heard what’s going on with Sheets lately? I’ve been so wrapped up in the NFL playoffs I haven’t heard much about him. Last I heard he was getting a lot of interest from Texas…

by IBleedYankeeBlue12 on Feb 1, 2009 7:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs