Thinking About Alternatives to Andy
by jscape2000 on Jan 4, 2009 11:45 AM EST
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Given AJ Burnett's injury history and Joba's innings cap, I don't see how the Yanks can enter the 2009 season without one more starting pitcher on the depth chart.
Via MLBTR and FanGraphs, the remaining free agents with 2008 WHIPs at 1.4 or less.
Bartolo Colon (36) pitched 39 innings in 2008, and less than 200IP total since 2005.
Freddy Garcia (33) pitched 15 innings in 2008. Injury plagued since 6 straight 200IP seasons from 2001-2006.
Jon Garland (29) - Type B, offered arb; posted a 1.51 WHIP, so he shouldn't make the list. But his .315 BABIP was well above his .289 career average. He might have been unlucky or he could be entering an early decline (.313, .290, .315 BABIP last 3 seasons)
Jon Lieber (39) another injury victim, hasn't topped 150 combined innings the last 2 seasons.
Braden Looper (34) - Type B, not offered arb, 1.3 WHIP and 199IP. Could he be had on a two-year deal?
Rodrigo Lopez (33)- After a mediocre but durable career in Bal'more, the 2002 ROY runner-up put up decent numbers in an injury shortened campaign in Colorado.
Derek Lowe (36) - Type A, offered arb, and will command a 3 year deal.
Oliver Perez (27) - Type A, offered arb. The subject of several columns today. He walked 105 in 194IP. In the NL.
Tim Redding (31) had a disastrous 1IP for the Yanks on July 15, 2005 against the Red Sox (4H, 4BB, 6R). I was in a bar in Aurora, NY that night. I got there just in time for the first pitch, waiting for a buddy to get off from work at the restaurant across the street. It was a good thing we'd planned for him to drive home.
Ben Sheets (30) - Type A, offered arb. The Yanks seem to view Sheets as plan B, but I'd sign him today if he could be had on a 1 or 2 year deal.
John Smoltz (42) - Type B, not offered arb. He technically makes the cut, but I think the Atlanta lifer will play for the Braves or not at all.
Randy Wolf (32) - Type B, not offered arb. Wolf actually pitched better at the Houston Launching Pad than he had in the pitcher's heaven in San Diego. But he gave up 16 runs in 19.2 IP against AL teams.
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Who picked Perez and Lieber?
Seriously.
"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden
by SenorSwanky on Jan 4, 2009 1:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
There've gotta be some jokesters on here
Someone actually voted for Randy Wolf and 3 people voted for Freddy Garcia. Do we need more injuries and mediocrity? Sheets is risky enough.
"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden
by SenorSwanky on Jan 4, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Never trust the integrity of an internet poll
But with the stories I’m reading today about Sheets’ shoulder, even I’m wonder if he’s worth the risk. But there’s a bargain price for every risk.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
by jscape2000 on Jan 4, 2009 5:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Andy's coming back
Where else is he going to go? Nobody’s going to give him a better deal.
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Jan 4, 2009 2:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
You think
the Dodgers wouldn’t offer the $12M they’re saving on Jones? As burned as Astros fans felt when Andy came back to NY, I bet they’d be happy to slot him in behind Oswalt in the rotation.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
by jscape2000 on Jan 4, 2009 5:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You think he's worth $12M???
I love Andy, but I don’t think he’s going to get big money this go-round. Could be wrong, but I’m wagering Andy will be in pinstripes.
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Jan 4, 2009 7:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you don't think andy
would get offers, take a look at the list that Jscape posted. Who on that list would we really want to cement a rotation that has injury trouble written all over it? Say all you want about Andy’s performance down the stretch, but even when he was pitching mediocre he was eating innings. Thats really an ideal back of the rotation guy.
Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.
by Edwantsacracker on Jan 4, 2009 7:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
If Lowe is worth at least 12 per for 3, if Burnett is worth 16 for 5, I think Pettitte has to be worth 12 for a year, or 10 for 2.
"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."
by jscape2000 on Jan 4, 2009 7:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I really hope we get andy back,
or just let the kids go at it, I don’t want anyone else on that list of yours.
Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.
by Edwantsacracker on Jan 4, 2009 8:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe I'm an optimist
and you might be right that Andy will get other similar offers. But you said it yourself—he’s now an ideal back of the rotation guy. Optimal word(s) being back of the rotation. $10M-plus for a # 4 starter? In a recession? Dunno. I’ve been wrong before, but I am placing my peanuts on Andy in pinstripes. Maybe Cash throws another $1M into the pot…
I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque
by LateInningRelief on Jan 4, 2009 10:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he's an ideal back of the rotation guy
for a rotation like the Yankees have assembled. I think the biggest thing we need out of a starting pitcher can do for you is eat up innings. So I would almost be more inclined to value consistent high totals of innings pitched over other considerations like ERA and WHIP. There were only 34 pitchers last year that gave their team 200 Innings.
One of those was Mike Mussina, who was paid 11,071,029.
On the other hand people like Tim Lincecum, Cole Hamels, Chad Billingsley, and Jon Lester did it for basically nothing because they are young and cost controlled.
When we signed Mike Mussina he was being signed to be a back of the rotation guy. What we got from him was a stellar year, but I don’t think 12 million is too much to give Andy.
Can we match the 12 Million that Javier Vasquez made last year for similar numbers, I think so.
But my point is, we should pay Andy for someone we know can handle that kind of work load, or we should move on and let the kids do it. What I don’t want is throwing more money at injury risk players who haven’t had a full season in a long time.
Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.
by Edwantsacracker on Jan 4, 2009 11:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How about NONE OF THE ABOVE
We have Phil Hughes. 90 percent of Yankee fans seem to have given up on him at the age of 22 after he struggled and was injured in 2008.
He’s got glasses now. He can see the catcher. Give him as break. He’s our #5.
I love Andy, but if 10 mil aint enough after your 2008 and how the Yankees stood by you, then good luck.
Munson15
by Munson15 on Jan 4, 2009 10:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
totally agree munson
andy needs to take the ten million we offered him or get lost. I believe in hughes and we can replace andy fast if need be.
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
by kdog on Jan 4, 2009 10:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i believe in Hughes too
but, like Joba, he has an innings cap of about 130-150, and what if/when injury strikes one of the starters? pitching depth is necessary. we know Andy will give us about 200 average to above innings. that is valuable. i just dont have enough confidence in Hughes to stay healthy and/or pitch better than Pettitte in 2009.
by Travis G on Jan 5, 2009 8:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would love Lowe...
…if we hadn’t already signed Burnett. I was hoping we’d choose Lowe over Burnett. I would have easily trusted him to pitch well for four more years, to age 38 and a few months. I didn’t know this back then, and this has only increased my wish we had made a different choice, but I heard on MLB Network last night that Lowe is apparently one of only 10 active pitchers who have never been on the DL, so that’s the epitome of reliability. But what’s done is done. I too don’t want any of the above pitchers. It’s Andy or the winner of a spring training pitch-off (it seems to me like Aceves would be most durable and ready, to start off with, at least).
"If you lived in my grandfather's house...and you wanted to eat, you had to be a Yankees fan." --Joe Biden
by SenorSwanky on Jan 5, 2009 3:06 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hughes ...
"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will
by Ronster22 on Jan 5, 2009 12:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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