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When is it time

to let Hughes and/or IPK work out their issues in the minors?

I realize Joel Sherman is not a big draw around these parts, but his article this morning on demoting Hughes--

http://www.nypost.com/seven/04302008/sports/yankees/phils_like_time_for_a_demotion_108728.htm

--actually has a pretty informative quote from Hughes:

"It's not my decision. The mound is just as far away in Triple-A as it is here. Maybe I wouldn't be hit as hard. I have some things to work out. Where that is is not my call."

Maybe Hughes is ready to get off the big stage for a few weeks so he can get his confidence back?

1 recs  |  Comment 36 comments

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What I would do is read the suggestions over at

river ave blues put forth by Joe. What Joe suggests is that Hughes make his next start against Seattle to see what he can do against a weak hitting club. Then after that we come to a period where he could be skipped a few times if we need to give him a break to work on things in bullpen sessions.

The reason I like this approach is we also have IPK to worry about. We will find out in a couple days if his struggles are going to continue or if he is ready to turn a corner. But I don’t think we can afford to call up two AAA pitchers at once to be in the rotation. So if IPK is going to struggle I want to have the option of sending him down. Cause if anyone needs time to develop in the minors he does. His rise to the to pof the organization was totally unexpected, so it wouldn’t be too suprising to find out he really does need some time in the minors.

But I think something has to be done. Hughes needs more than two pitches. When he struggled two starts ago he threw almost all fastballs. Yesterday he threw like a quarter of his pitches as curves and the rest fastballs. Working with a new catcher everyday can’t help, but he has to show hitters all four of his pitches. I know they made him can his slider for most of the time that he was in the minors so he could work on his curve, but that was supposed to be his best pitch. He has to get back to that.

Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.

by Edwantsacracker on Apr 30, 2008 10:41 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Small sample size,

but I think IPK may be a bit closer to turning it around. He had a good few innings last go-round. Hughes genuinely looked a little lost last night. And my bigger concern is his thinking about working it out in the minors.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Apr 30, 2008 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't like Sherman

and the last line was so cheesy, but I think that someone has to do something about Phil. I think that Girardi did not help him with the lineup last night but Phil seems to be “lost” as Sherman points out. And Phil admits he’s struggling.

I do hate the “We wouldn’t give him up for Johan” argument. It was NOT just Phil, it was Phil plus Melky plus someone else and they STILL weren’t satisfied. It was as much about what MORE the Twinkies wanted (that the Mets, incredibly, did NOT have to give up) than about we wanted to keep Phil. I still think the Yankee no-trade was the right call and I think the Johan shadow is a bs argument.

I not only think Phil Hughes can be fixed but will be fixed so long as his mental state doesn’t take him down. He didn’t play college ball and maybe he needs a few more AAA starts before coming up.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Apr 30, 2008 11:10 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Work it out, Philly ...

After listening to Michael Kay, Flaherty and Leiter debate whether or not Hughes should be demoted, I reminded them that he’s just 21 years old, and everyone needs to take a deep breathe. Yes, he looked lost last night. Yes, his eyes had that “hold me” glow to them. But should he be sent down? No.

Phil has nothing to prove in the minors, and any tweaking of mechanics should be done under the watchful eye of Dave Eiland, his minor league guru. Sending him down will accomplish nothing as far as I’m concerned.

Take a look at these pitchers when they were 21-22:

-Greg Maddux was 6-14 with a 5.61 era
-Tom Glavine was 7-17 with a 4.56 era at 22
-John Smoltz was 2-7 with a 5.48 era
and Fausto Carmona was 1-10 with a 5.42 (his stats were skewed due to relief appearances).

We need to all take a collective breath and realize that he’s just 21. He will get better. He will figure it out-if we all just relax and maybe try to turn the pressure down just alittle. I mean did we really need to boo him off the mound? Do we really need to dissect every pitch, every move? I would suggest not-especially after looking at the early careers of Smoltz, Glavine, and Maddux.

On an unrelated side note, and not to blow my horn, but one of my AAU pitchers from years ago Clay Rapada pitched a strong inning for the Tigers last night!

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Apr 30, 2008 11:40 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good thing

the powers that be pulled the plug on ARoth. He would have been brutal this morning.

I’d give Phil one more start to show even a hint of progress, and if he doesn’t I’d go to Rasner.

People keep mentioning Glavine (Braves were 54-106), and Maddux (Cubs were 76-85) at Phil’s age, but their teams (Atlanta, Cubs) were horrible and they played in a city/stadium where no one gives a shit about losing. Smoltz’ 2-7 was based on 64 IP (Hughes threw 72 IP last year). The following year Smoltz was 12-11, 2.94, 208 IP on a 97 loss team.

This is still a win now team at the end of the day, and the growing pains need to stop asap. Phil looks afraid to fail.

Sending him to the minors, where he can regain the feeling of what its like to get hitters out, and he can relearn to trust his stuff, might not be a bad idea.

"Well, that kind of puts a damper on even a Yankees win."
-- Phil Rizzuto after hearing about the Pope's death

by matthaggs on Apr 30, 2008 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe Phil just

needs somebody to give him a talking-to. I don’t know what type of personality he has, how he responds to more aggressive tactics, but I kind of think that somebody ought to say, dude, what do you mean, ‘maybe going to the minors is okay’?!? You need to get it together and work through this. Today.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Apr 30, 2008 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It is when ...

his pitching coach is with the parent club. No one knows him better than Eiland, and he’s the one that has to channel old young Phil and stand him back on the hill. Sending him down at this point is pointless.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Apr 30, 2008 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I totally agree Ron

It’s Eiland who Hughes needs to work with, so MLB is the place for him, even if they need to skip him a turn in the rotation.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 30, 2008 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

no

I think the booing was uncalled for. I also fault Girardi for putting him in that situation. And I think he will rebound if his brain doesn’t explode first.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Apr 30, 2008 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I felt so bad for him

when he was getting booed off the mound. He’s my age.

Crowds are won and lost and won again, but our hearts beat for the diehards.

by Edwantsacracker on Apr 30, 2008 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Booing hurts at any age.

I recall the first time I got booed. No lie. I was in 3rd grade, and we were doing a Patriots’ Day celebration and I forgot my line. I stood there, frozen in time when a fat fourth grader started booing. It caught on. I ran off the stage.

UPDATE: Years later I appeared on Maury to confront the fat fourth grader and tell him that he destroyed my life.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Apr 30, 2008 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

how much of this is true?

I thought only Massachusetts celebrated Patriots Day.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Apr 30, 2008 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What, you got a corner on patriotism?

I grew up in Jersey and in school we celebrated Patriots Day… although now that I think about it it might have been President’s Day. Whatever. The Maury part wasn’t true. Although years later, I met the kid in a bar and we all had a good laugh about it—after he bought me several beers.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 1, 2008 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not from MA

but when I lived there the Boston Marathon was held on Patriots Day and to my knowledge, they were the only US state that celebrated it as in closed schools etc.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 3, 2008 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good thing

the powers that be pulled the plug on ARoth. He would have been brutal this morning.

I’d give Phil one more start to show even a hint of progress, and if he doesn’t I’d go to Rasner.

People keep mentioning Glavine, Smoltz and Maddux (76-85) at Phil’s age, but that team was horrible and they played in a city where no one gives a shit.

This is still a win now team at the end of the day, and the growing pains need to stop asap.

"Well, that kind of puts a damper on even a Yankees win."
-- Phil Rizzuto after hearing about the Pope's death

by matthaggs on Apr 30, 2008 12:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

oops

double post

"Well, that kind of puts a damper on even a Yankees win."
-- Phil Rizzuto after hearing about the Pope's death

by matthaggs on Apr 30, 2008 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, can you imagine ...

it would sound something like this:
BLAH, BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH,BLAH… Yankees suck.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Apr 30, 2008 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's the first time

I’ve actually seen a horizontal scroll bar on a post. Guess if there are no spaces, it doesn’t have a place to do an auto return….

I hope it wasn’t my FAR post that convinced the admins that Roth was creating too much trouble. I actually enjoyed putting that together. Maybe I’ll need to focus my editorial critiques elsewhere.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Apr 30, 2008 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No...

As I said on the Game Thread last night, we Jscape and I mulled that over for months. I think if it were completely up to him, it would have been done last Nov/Dec.

by anaconda on Apr 30, 2008 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he was a total energy suck

I did manage to learn to detach from him but that is because I wanted to hunt him down and kill him and unless it’s an exboyfriend, it’s just not worth the trouble. :)

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Apr 30, 2008 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow

Ronster, you getting all this? Stay away from chica- she’s one of the those girls...

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 30, 2008 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It was a joke

but one I like :)

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 1, 2008 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pyscho Chicks are HOT!!!

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 1, 2008 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oops. Misspelling due to medication.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 1, 2008 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

and

some non-psycho chicks (who can spell) are hot too. ;)

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 1, 2008 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yikes...

Thanks for letting us get to know the real bxgrl.

by anaconda on Apr 30, 2008 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dated a girl like that

for a few months while I was in grad school. She was a Mets fan…

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 30, 2008 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know a lot of girls like that now

We call them “patients” where I’m working.

by anaconda on Apr 30, 2008 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh you

and your psych ward humor

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 30, 2008 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh p'shaw!

It was a joke but it’s always one that rattles guys. HA!

I’m actually the opposite way. I’m always like, “What did I do with x?” Wasn’t he my boyfriend? I guess I inadvertently broke up with him.” Boyfriends, like plants, don’t seem to thrive with inattention. :) I lose more of them that way.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 1, 2008 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dated

a girl in grad school who took meds for something she would never discuss. I even went so far as to check her medicine cabinet. Nothing. One night while dining in Hilton Head, SC, she went off on a waiter because he brought her the wrong entree—totally freaked me out. I broke up with her a week or so later.

Two months later, I’m reading in my living room and I look up and see her face in my window. Can you spell restraining order?

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 1, 2008 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

OMG that's hilarious

I think you were the one last year that talked about being with or having been with beautiful but crazy. (was that you?)

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 1, 2008 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I find mildly crazy chicks kinda' hot ...

but when I saw her face in my window, it scared the crap outta’ me. I really did have to go the restraining order thing. But it’s cool. It’s a great conversation piece …

Hey, how are you?
I’m fine. I’m the CEO of a software company and I flew in on my private jet. What about you?
Oh, I’m cool. I’ve got a stalker.
Really? Tell me more.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 2, 2008 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I moved to Cambridge MA

because of a stalker. Chose Hahvard over Columbia much to my dismay.

In retrospect, I should have taken my chances with the stalker. He liked it when I took him to court so I stopped doing that and started moving.

The years in Bahstin were somewhat miserable. While I was up there I got a message from the stalker via a friend who ran into him in a grocery store. “I know she’s in Massachusetts and tell her she’s dead.”

Nice. I moved to CA after that for grad school and later law school. I knew he was afraid to fly. I keep tabs on him (unbeknownst to him) since I’ve been back in the Apple.

Some stalkers are more personable than others. Mine had the personality of a bed bug.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on May 3, 2008 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Different for girls

A guy with a female stalker can be cool. Mine was harmless—I think. When I moved to VA, she stayed in SC and hopefully got the help she needed. However, when a woman has a male stalker who says things like, “You’re dead.” That suggests it’s time to get that gun permit you’ve been putting off.

Where in CA do you live? Not that I’m stalking you. But I’ve got all kinds of friends in LA/Hollywood area. Are you in entertainment law?

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on May 5, 2008 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I did not know

That Phil only threw 5 AAA games. Maybe he should go down for a while. I’m a little on the fence about it but whatever will fix him, I’m for it. I’m not sure he knows how to deal with failure and there is no bigger failure than being boo’d off the mound in the Bronx. That’s enough to crush a kid. I hope it makes him stronger.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Apr 30, 2008 12:36 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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