My problem with Hank

by anaconda on Apr 21, 2008 5:10 PM EDT in Analysis Comment 19 comments

As every PA regular knows, there is no bigger supporter of the Joba needs to be in the rotation argument than me.

That said, I was perusing ESPN this morning and Buster Olney nails my problem with Hank Steinbrenner by opening his big mouth to the NYT:

Although I agree that Joba needs to make the switch in 2008, that switch cannot be done right now. Brian Cashman has already come out today and made that clear. Joba has an innings cap of roughly 140-150 IP and it's best for the team to utilize him the best they can until they find a viable replacement for him in June or July.

I was a big supporter of promoting Joba to the major league club last season and helping out the pen as long as his long term future was as a starter. He was already closing in on his innings cap and the Yanks were desperate for help. Of course, nobody in their right mind could have expected Joba to thoroughly dominate as he did. Hank doesn’t seem to understand that the Yanks may not have made the playoffs in 2008 without his enormous contribution.

Above all, my biggest problem with Hank speaking so “candidly” is the inevitable repercussions his words are going to have on Joe Girardi for the next two months. Every time Hughes, Kennedy, or Moose has a bad night, you can bet the ranch that the “Joba in the rotation” question will be asked by a Kim Jones or George A. King III.

Hank’s words are a distraction and unnecessary and he should know better. Unfortunately, he doesn’t and that’s why Hank really needs to shut up altogether and leave all public relation duties to Brian Cashman.

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Yes

With ya, Anaconda. Hank: shut up. I’ve never been a fan of the Steinbrenner family and the way that they run the team, beyond their unquestionable commitment to winning. Hank has once again demonstrated that he can be as irrational as his father, and perhaps twice as ignorant. The current flap demonstrates that sports owners best serve their teams if they are committed to winning, let their money do the talking, and shut up and stay on the sidelines. But, he’s an owner and has a right to be stupid.

Joba needs to become a starter this year, but it needs to be done in a way in which they aren’t forced to shut him down in August when he hits his innnings limit. The Bombers have a reasonable plan in place and should stick with it.

by Four Train on Apr 21, 2008 5:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It will get worse

if Hughes and Kennedy continue to pitch poorly while Johan strikes out 10 guys a game in Queens.

Hank is a dope who will begin to believe (if he doesn’t already) that he is smarter than Cashman, and that can only lead to disaster.

"Well, that kind of puts a damper on even a Yankees win."
-- Phil Rizzuto after hearing about the Pope's death

by matthaggs on Apr 21, 2008 6:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hank is a dope, Cashman is a dope

Good recipe for success. Can you imagine that they could’ve had Johan even if they were willing to give up this piece of crap Kennedy?

by andyroth on Apr 22, 2008 1:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

At times like this...

I like to look down at my braclet that says, WWARD…What would Andy Roth Do?

by Rusty23 on Apr 21, 2008 6:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Thanks for thinking of me

The Dark Cloud I’ve been bestowed will hanging over Yankee Stadium as long as “Clowns In Pinstripes” are running the show.

by andyroth on Apr 22, 2008 1:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Damn straight

The policy was in place with all the vagueness of a CIA memo, there’s no reason to refocus attention on any part of the plan- that will only cause distortion. One of the things that Steinbrenner (or his handlers) got right as he grew old was to hurry him past all the reporters.

Just because they have more questions doesn’t mean that you always have to expand on the answers you’ve already given.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 21, 2008 6:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Actual Quote from Chris Russo

re: Joba
With most guys you have a track record in the minors or college of being a dominating guy…with Joba you have neither.

It might not be exact, but I swear to god thats what he said.

by seanp23 on Apr 21, 2008 8:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You are correct

I actually heard some of this gibberish today from both of those guys. Russo also said that Joba shouldn’t be starting because he wasn’t that highly touted as a starter since the Yanks got him at the bottom of the 1st Round.

Ridiculous. I know Jscape and I would do a better job analyzing this team on the radio.

by anaconda on Apr 21, 2008 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I actually had to turn it off

I dont know whos worse. Francessa is so arrogantly ignorant and Russo is just plain ignorant. I mean, the entire station is asleep at the wheel. Even the young guy, Evan Roberts with Benigno, he sometimes shows flashes of being semi informed but then he’ll revert back and say something about the Mets “chemistry” being the reason they blew it last year.

by seanp23 on Apr 21, 2008 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He and Francessa

are morons

by andyroth on Apr 22, 2008 1:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Heard the same show

with Russo quoting that Joba couldn’t be that dominant if he lost to Manhattan in the Regionals in 2006.
Russo is just glorious that Tim Lincecum of his SF Giants is 3-0 in the 2008 season and was picked 10th overall in that same draft.
Russo is just a Yankee hater.

by thejobarules on Apr 21, 2008 8:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Interesting char with Jayson Stark on this topic

http://sports.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=20303&;lpos=spotlight&lid=tab4pos1

Can't pitch Gagne in rain. He’s like the B-2 bomber of baseball.--TheJay

by verno329 on Apr 21, 2008 10:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I am probably far enoughed removed

from George’s spit-fire days to romanticize pere Steinbrenner, but yeah, this comment from Hank is dumb on so many levels. I actually defended Hank during the Santana sweepstakes for basically going public with stuff that needed to be kept in-house. Now? Oy. I really think this guy is going to say dopey things for years to come.

I absolutely agree that Joba needs to get his chance in the rotation. My biggest question mark is basically putting all this added pressure on him. I suppose if we’re going in the suck because we can’t get outs, there’s no reason not to move Joba as soon as practical. But there is, in my view, about a 20% chance that he will meet everybody’s expectations in 2008. He could respond better than Phil and IPK—he certainly has with fewer innings. But do we really need to create more fanfare, more pressure and more unrealistic expectations for this kid?

Man. Let the guy pitch. Streatch him out if it’s best. I’d even be cool with throwing him into the rotation pre-All Star break if IPK, Moose and Phil don’t turn it around. But this is one case where you need to table the midless, rah rah bullshit and let the guy develop at his own pace. And expect that he’s going to get hammered.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Apr 21, 2008 10:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hank's new comments

appeard in the New York Daily news today.

After stating in an earlier interview that he wanted Chamberlain as a starter as soon as possible, Steinbrenner tempered his stance to the New York Daily News, telling the newspaper that he is willing to stick with the team’s plan of putting the right-hander in the rotation later in the year.

“It’s all of our intention to try to get him back into the rotation by the end of the year,” Steinbrenner told the Daily News. “I’ve addressed it many times, as did Joe [Girardi] and [GM Brian] Cashman. I’m just saying it would be nice to have him there right now. He’s going to be great anywhere we have him but, my preference is as a starter and that’s everybody else’s preference, too.

“You see what a premium starting pitching is. The bullpen is important, but starting pitching is 70 percent of it. Your bullpen can’t do you any good if you’re down by five runs quickly every night. It’s logical.”

I really thought Hank was trying to deflect attention away from the two youngsters Kennedy and Hughes by trying to get the attention on himself. It was a tactic his father performed quite nicely during his reign of terror.

by thejobarules on Apr 21, 2008 10:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Timetable

As long as the Yankees adhere to the +30 Rule, I will worry Joba will not get enough innings this season to be a 180 inning starter in 2009. Things happen that cause players to miss time. Joba’s father fell ill and Joba missed a week.

What happens if the Yanks wait too long to move him to the rotation and he has to miss a couple weeks for an unforseen reasona nd finishes 2008 with just 130 IP? Will he be limited agin in 2009 to just 160 IP and start agin in the bullpen?

With a 12-man pitching staff, I see no reason why Joba can’t be a 4-5 inning start for half the season and be paired with Kennedy or Moose for the other 4 innings.

Fake Teams - a proud member of the SB Nation

by faketeams on Apr 22, 2008 8:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I worry about that too

but there’s not way to plan for it. Sometimes stuff like that happens and you have to adjust.

As for the tag-team starter approach, I just don’t see it working. If IPK is dealing, do you pull him after five just because you’ve got Joba waiting? If Joba struggles do you burn the rest of the bullpen?

I think it’s the right kind of innovative thinking about how to deal with the problem, but sports teams and athletes are legendarily resistant to innovation.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 22, 2008 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

what about a system

where the three rotate in and out of the rotation and when not in the rotation they have their throw days out of the pen, most likely the day Mussina shits the bed?

Im not really sold on this idea myself.

by seanp23 on Apr 22, 2008 8:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I suggested a similiar idea

over the offseason. Let Wang and Pettitte start every 5th day, and rotate Joba, Hughes, IPK, and Moose through the other 3 spots/bullpen. It makes the most sense to me- it would limit those four to about 25 starts each, which would fit the 150IP limit perfectly.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Apr 22, 2008 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs