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Bobby Abreu

It is reported That Bobby would like to come back and is looking for a 3 year deal.

For the 34 year old Abreu 3 years would be his 35, 36 and 37 year old seasons.  I really like his lefthanded bat and plate discipline.

I would like to enter serious negotiations.  Right field is not a position where I want to give up offense to upgrade defense.  I don't like the available FA outfielders better than Bobby.

Questions or comments?

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Are you President of the Bobby Abreu Fan Club?

No way will he get 3 years from the Yanks.

They will offer him arbitration and he’ll probably reject it – giving them a compensation draft pick when he signs elsewhere.

Cashman has been telegraphing this move for awhile now – especially when you consider the Nady deal.

by anaconda on Oct 8, 2008 6:03 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

We'll see,won't we

he will be offered arb. But he may resign, and I hope he does.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 8, 2008 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

my problem is that

his walk rate has gone down considerablly over the last few seasons, and his power too, and his defense.

looking at fangraph, he’s also reaching outside the zone more than he use to.

he’s still a solid player, but at 3 years I have my reservations. career wise he’s a very good but not hall of fame caliber player.

for the OF, the Yanks need to pencil Damon back to CF for most of 09 until something force itself to happen, and bring in a LF while keeping Nady in right. ideally I’d do Manny Ramirez, though Adam Dunn is a solid option too.

by RollingWave on Oct 9, 2008 2:51 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Tough one for me

I really like Abreu. No he’s not a great fielder, and if not for his arm, he’d no doubt suck in the outfield. But he’s a quality, professional hitter. Bringing him back into a crowded outfield situation is a tough call. Yes I’d love his bat, his presence but we need to get younger. Frankly I’m over the 3 year deals for guys in their mid-30s. I’d make a pass, but would ultimately let him go.

As for Ramirez or Dunn, I’ve commented that Manny would be interesting but I don’t think Manny’s the right guy to wear pinstripes. As for Dunn, I don’t think we need a slow-footed, free swinging banger who makes minimal contact and ks 140+ times a year. No thanks.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2008 9:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It is a tough one

But I see him as a Tino, O’Neil type. A good solid player we don’t have to give up anything we have to get. I guess a business major would say there’s an opportunity cost of the draft choice we don’t get by letting him go.

Manny is a hall of fame player with solid hitting left in him. No, great hitting. His taste in baggy uniforms disguises the fact that he’s in better shape.

However his head is even more fragile than Arod’s. If the faithful boo him he’ll blow up. And we’ll boo him the first time his slump coincides with a team slump, or he makes the inevitable bone head play.

Manny is a bad idea. To bad, he’s a local guy and I think he’s love to play in NY and get a plaque in monument park.

Who wouldn’t, but he has more talent than…. almost anybody I ever saw.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 9, 2008 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dunn

has one of the lowest O-Swing% in the majors, he’s anything but a free swinger.

he’s kinda like the exact opposite of Vlad , a guy that only swing at strikes but have trouble making contact (Vlad is a guy that swing and make contact with anything)

he has he’s problems, but also his plus. and he might be undervalued in the market, though I’d still take Manny over him unless he’s asking for crazy years.

by RollingWave on Oct 10, 2008 6:14 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

for A-rod's sake

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again…we need a monster to hit behind A-Rod. A-rod should be hitting 3rd not 4th and Abreu is the log jam in the situation. Abreu can’t hit 4th and by default A-Rod has been hitting 4th because no one else can hit there. We should be looking for a #4 hitter, not Tex, not Abreu, not Giambi….to me the only realistic solution is Manny at DH hitting 4th. The unrealistic #4 hitter is Ryan Howard, Prince Fielder or someone like them. But then again this is the Yankees we are talking about. What would we have to trade to get Howard type? Hughes, IPK, Mellky and Joba? It’s unrealistic. Manny is the best option in my mind.

by tozer55 on Oct 9, 2008 11:12 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

yes and no

I agree that Arod shouldn’t be out cleanup hitter. my dream lineup would be: Jeter/Damon, Arod, Tex, Manny, etc.

no, it wouldn’t take THAT much to get Howard. i’m sure he could be had for Hughes, IPK and Melky, but if we wouldn’t do that for the great Santana, why do it for Howard? substitute ZMac for Hughes and it might get done.

by Travis G on Oct 11, 2008 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No to Abreu

Although Abreu can be regarded as a professional hitter, the Yankees will not sign him to a 3 year deal. A-Rod can be one of the greatest hitters of all time, but he still needs someone to protect him. No one in the current line-up can do this, not Abreu, Giambi, etc.
I would go after Tex if Posada can catch effectively in 2009. If Posada cannot catch, they will need to put him at 1B. If Posada plays 1B in 2009, then they will need to go after Manny although he comes with a log of baggage. No matter what you say about Manny, he will protect A-Rod in the line-up. I would hope that NYY go after either Tex or Manny and one quality SP. It has been clear that 200M + payroll doesn’t win you a championship. The Yankees need to spend the money wisely and form a right chemistry.

by yankeesintexas on Oct 9, 2008 12:36 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

No to Manny ...

We need a banger … let’s make a pass at Fielder. Apparently he is available. I’d also make a push for Peavy who is rumored to be available. I recall my junior-senior banquet in high school. Weeks before, my buddies and I lamented what appeared to be the inevitable … we weren’t going to get dates. Then one day during baseball practice, I spied a group of girls—THE girls. One in particular I had the screamin’ thigh sweats for. My buddies all said, “she’s outta’ your league,” “she’ll shoot you down.”

Sure it was improbable. As I made my way to her I realized I was grasping for the moon. But if you don’t ask, you don’t get to play. I nervously asked, and she accepted. It was one of the best night’s of my young life.

This is what Cashman MUST do. Draw up a dream list and have the balls to ask.

Again, I love Abreu, but we need guys like Crawford, Fielder, Peavy … take a shot.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2008 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You might be able to get Crawford

if you just wait one more year until he’s a free agent.

by rory_sayer on Oct 9, 2008 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Peavy/Fielder

It would be nice to have both FIeler and Peavy, but NYY will have to give up just about everyone in their system such as Hughes, IPK, Jackson, Cano, Betances, ……etc. I think this goes against Cash’s philosophy. NYY almost made a playoff without the services (full or partial) of Wang, Matsui, Posada. They do not need to overhaul the entire organization. They need to fill up some holes here and there and form a better chemistry.

by yankeesintexas on Oct 9, 2008 2:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Agreed, but ...

We do need to get younger, and we can’t discount the importance of having valuable role players along the lines of Brosious, Martinez, O’Neill, Williams and Girardi. I think with the signing of Giambi, we sort of got away from that philosophy, and adopted one more reminiscent of the mid-80s when George assembled all-star teams that never really gelled.

We’ve got some a number of first ballot Hall of Famers on this team, and I think we need not rush towards more. Sure I like Tex, and I like CC even more, but at what cost. Wouldn’t it make more sense to fill in the gaps with younger, cheaper multi-dimensional role guys who play hard.

Someone earlier mentioned Kotchman. What a great idea. I’d love his glove at first base. Is he headed to the Hall? Not a chance. But he’s solid and he’s cheap. He’d know his role and he’d fit in. Nady is another one, and so is Gardner (if he can hit .260). These are the guys to target. I’d put Fielder in that class as well as Crawford. I’m tired of us breaking the bank on guys who underperform, and fear that might be the case with CC and Tex.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Oct 9, 2008 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ummm

not sure if was said above… but there is this guy named Xavier Nady who will be playing RF for the Yanks next year.

Check out my baseball analysis blog FANalytics

by jbluestone on Oct 9, 2008 10:47 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

why not?
Right field is not a position where I want to give up offense to upgrade defense.

Abreu was just horrible in the field last year, more than 20 runs worse than the average right fielder. 20 runs over a full season is about .100 points of OPS or about .13 runs of team ERA. He was about as valuable as Akinori Iwamura (mediocre bat, more important position, solid defender) and Franklin Gutierrez (bad bat, but AWESOME in the field) this year. Not sure why you’d want to sign a league-average player to a large contract for three years in his late thirties when the team already has a few DH types.

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Oct 10, 2008 10:29 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

There are four positions on the diamond where teams

Put good offense, bad d players.
First
Left
Right
Third
in that order. I consider the Defensive stats you posit to be nonesense.
Abreu has pluses and minuses.
Pluses are speed and arn
He has fair “hands”
Minus is arm is inconsistent for accuracy and he has a serious problem near walls. They distract him from the ball and his route to them.
The places you give up O for D are, in order
Catcher
SS
Second
CF
You want to upgrade the D? GEt a stud centerfielder or secondbaseman.
Meanwhile, I hope the Yanks resign Bobby Abreu.
Additionally, watch them play. He’s a good guy who has fun. He’s a plus to the chemestry of the team that needs these pluses.
I’m not sold on Nady.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 10, 2008 11:30 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

THere are two aspects to a position players game

There is how many runs he can produce, and how many runs he can help prevent.

So if you have a team defense that allows a ton of extra runs, it offsets a lot of what that offense can do. And actually a run prevented is a bit more valuable then a run scored.

I am not saying you should sign light hitting players who have stellar defense, but I am saying that even at those positions where defense is 2ndary, it is still a factor that contributes to a winning ball club.

E.G. If abreu contributes say 106 runs offensivley but costs his team 20 runs defensivley, that is a net gain of 86 runs. Iwamura created 89 runs offensivley so even if hes a net zero defender in runs prevented… he still has more value in winning games then abreu.

The best example of this is probably win shares.

Abreu had 24 win shares last year 21.7 batting and 2.4 fielding.
Randy Winn had 22 win shares last yera 17.4 batting and 4.5 fielding.

That is an example of two players who had about an equal amount of contributions to team wins 8 for abreu and 7.33 for Winn yet one did it with stronger batting the other did it with slightly lesser batting but superior fielding.

Check out my baseball analysis blog FANalytics

by jbluestone on Oct 11, 2008 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bull

the stats you lean on are statistical mumbo jumbo.

I hope you’re too smart to believe your own arguement.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 11, 2008 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You said the same thing about WHIP

The defensive stats aren’t perfect, but the folks who calculate it watch every play and measure the trajectory of every hit (grounder, line drive, fly) and the location of each catch.

I don’t trust the details (2.4 and 4.5), but I’ll buy that Winn (a former CF with an accurate arm and a .306/.363/.426 line in 598 ABs) prevented close to twice as many runs as Abreu (.296/.371/.471 in 609) when measured against the average RF. I’m actually surprised that .008 of OBP and .045 SLG is worth 4.3 Win Shares.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Oct 11, 2008 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Winn played

in the pitcher friendly NL West, while Abreu was in the relatively hitter-friendly AL East. that counts for something.

by Travis G on Oct 12, 2008 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think I did

WHIP as a measure makes sense as it measures baserunners.

What I object too is trying to sum up a player by adding unrelated, and subjectively arrived at defensive stats, the value of which I’m unconvinced of, to fairly straightforward defensive stats.

Also, I personally rank baseball skills importance in this order.

Pithcing
Hitting (heart of thr order)
Defense (middle)
Hitting (other)
Defense (other)

So Abreu’s hitting, worthy of second through fifth almosty anywhere is more important than his D which is right field. He just does not handle that many chances, and many of them are routine, which he does fine.

I watch him play,and Manny. I know who is terrible defender and who is not. I just don’t buy those stats. I believe there must be bias in the people who do the rating.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 12, 2008 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

3Bs are about as valuable defensively as 2B and CFs

and the reason the bad defenders are put at 1B and LF/RF is because they receive fewer opportunities to cost their teams runs. it’s like putting a poor reliever as the mop-up guy instead of as the set-up guy. they are still bad pitchers/fielders, but they don’t hurt as much.

and the key words are “as much”. if a 1B or LF/RF is a really poor fielder, it kills their offensive value. one of the biggest reasons the Yankees have underachieved in the eyes of mainstream fans/analysts is that their fielding has stunk for a while now. fix that. now.

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Oct 14, 2008 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Offer arb to Abreu

Then try to sign him. If you fail it’s not a total loss

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

by Cbeck3 on Oct 11, 2008 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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