Boston now leading Santana sweepstakes?

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 12:19 PM EST Comment 39 comments

Twin Cities is reporting that the Sox are now the leading contenders to get Santana. Of course, there's no indication whether or not Johan wants to go to BOS, but if true, this would truly suck.

http://www.twincities.com/ci_7584709?source=most_viewed

A little birdie says the Boston Red Sox have become the favorite in the Johan Santana trade sweepstakes.

The Twins would receive four players for the Twins' two-time Cy Young Award winner, including center fielder Coco Crisp, 28.

Others would be shortstop prospect Jed Lowry, 23; left-handed pitcher Jon Lester, 23; and right-handed pitcher Justin Masterson, 22.

Before a deal could be made, the Red Sox would have to have time to negotiate a contract extension with Santana, 28, who can become a free agent after next season and could have a market value as high as $150 million over six years.

Lowry did not play in the major leagues this year but is considered ready and is a good-fielding shortstop who also can hit. Lowry had a slugging percentage of .500 at Class AA and Class AAA this year.

Lester made a comeback from non-Hodgkin's lymphoma a year ago and is said to be cancer-free.

Masterson, 6 feet 6, 245 pounds, had 59 strikeouts in 58 innings at Class AA Portland.

The New York Yankees don't have the prospects available who the Twins figure have a reasonable chance to play in the major leagues by the end of 2008.

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Eek

That would be a strong package. If I were Boston, though, I would stick with the youngsters--deal Lugo, promote Lowry, and get Masterson ready for the rotation. They don't seem to need another ace. A rotation of Santana, Beckett, Dice-K, Schilling, and Buchholz/Wakefield (or both, if they go with a 6-man) is scary.

by SenorSwanky on Nov 29, 2007 12:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i think that package is pretty weak

coco? seriously? as long as theo doesn't have to part with buchholz, del carmen or ellsbury, then it will be a steal for boston.

by Clutch like Leyritz on Nov 30, 2007 6:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

there probably just

exagerating this so they get the Yanks to give up more. i say fuck it, just stick with what we got.

by Soriano NY 12 on Nov 29, 2007 12:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

This is probably made up.

To drive the Yankees price up.

Stay cool Cashman!

Save the big 3.

by randomize on Nov 29, 2007 1:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Agree ...

I really don't see how Boston can afford him. I really do think it's a ploy... A good one. Hmmm, I wonder if Bor-Ass is behind it :)

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Nov 29, 2007 2:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The Sox

can afford it. They have the cash (Ramirez, Shilling coming off the books) and the prospects.

I think Theo is too good of a GM to let go of Ellsbury and Buchholz.

Boras isn't involved or else Santana would be asking for 10 years 200 million.

Why even do business with Boras anyway? Most of his clients tank after a big contract and the rest (ARod) aren't worth the money.

by randomize on Nov 29, 2007 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Just curious

What is your opinion of the A-Rod deal?

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 29, 2007 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Don't know ...

if you were referring to me or not, but I like the way the organization handled it. Arod was abit humbled. I would have let him walk, but getting him back in the fold was necessary--especially considering the cost of other options.

Money has never been a big issue for NY, but surrendering talent is. On that front I'm glad we didn't have to land someone else (Cabrera, Rolen, Crede, Tejada) and give up prized talent.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Nov 29, 2007 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I wasn't

I was making fun of randomize's insistence on mentioning the A-Rod contract in 99% of his posts. I am surprised he didn't factor in Mark Teixeira into this thread..yet.

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 29, 2007 4:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I also

find it hilarious that you can't seem to reply to me without referencing that post.

It sounds like the only response you know is mockery and condescension, not rational arguments or facts.

My mentioning of ARod here was relevant since the topic of Boras came up.

If you'd like to sit and explain why ARod's contract is so great, I'd like to listen.

Or you can go on posting empty, useless statements. My guess is you pick the latter. It take less effort and thought.

by randomize on Nov 29, 2007 4:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm a little tied up this afternoon

I am finishing a piece for the Mark Teixeira fan club newsletter, but I will respond the way I always have. The Yanks paid to retain the best player in baseball and they can afford to overpay so I have no problem with it.

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 29, 2007 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You are an evil man

funny, but evil.

"Baseball is the background music of my life." -George Will

by Ronster22 on Nov 30, 2007 8:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The problem

as Gammons has pointed out, is that Beckett will ask for $20M per year as well. That would present a problem for them.

Phil Hughes will own you.

by marcbouch9 on Nov 30, 2007 4:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

forget em', i want my petite back.

:o/

no really... i'm fine. it's just a game.

by smoly81 on Nov 29, 2007 1:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

More from the Boston Herald

By all indications, the Red Sox have made it clear to the Minnesota Twins that they would be willing to part with Jon Lester, Clay Buchholz or even Jacoby Ellsbury in a deal for Santana, the left-handed ace who is generally regarded as the best pitcher in baseball. What the Sox do NOT seem willing to do is part with a combination of those players. The bottom line is that Ellsbury, Buchholz or Lester could be in any package for Santana, but that two (or more) of them will not go in the deal.

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 2:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Forgot the link

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/red_sox/index.php/2007/11/29/yo-yo-johan/

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 2:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Are you kidding?

As Joe P. pointed out at RAB, I think we can beat that package without trading a member of the Trinity.

Masterson is a very good AA pitcher.
Jed Lowrie is a good prospect at shortstop (.300/.356/.506 in 40 games at AAA).
Lester is a left handed IPK.
Crisp will turn 29 next season, and he's such a great player that he lost his starting job in center field.

"Have faith in the Yankees, my son. Think of the great DiMaggio."

by jscape2000 on Nov 29, 2007 2:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Another day

another soap opera piece. This is shaking down to Boston and NYY.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/jon_heyman/11/29/thursday.scoop/index.html

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 29, 2007 2:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

yeah

Buster Olney seems to say the same.. with Boston in the lead at this point-- but also stipulates that both sides may just be trying to drive the other's price up.

You don't realize how easy this game is until you get up in that broadcasting booth. -Mickey Mantle

by NumberSeven on Nov 29, 2007 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

My first post...

Here is what I think would happen if the Yankees got Santana:

The Yankees will make the playoffs in 2008 (which they more than likely would without him as well)
Even more pressure would be put on the Yanks to win because they would have the best hitter and best pitcher in baseball. So of course when all the superstar hitters go into their normal October slump (due to pressure to live up to their contracts) Santana will have to have his "A" game every single post season start. By "A" game I mean 8+ innings of shut out baseball because he can't afford to turn the ball over to anyone in that bullpen except Rivera. Even when Andy Pettitte pitched 6.1 innings of shutout ball in game two of the ALCS this year that was not enough to win.
So of course they will be eliminated the first round and the media and the baseball world will have a bigger field day bashing the Yanks.
Mean while some second tier team like the Cardinals in 2006 will probably squeak by and win the World Series because half of the playoffs is luck anyway and no matter how much a team spends it can't change that fact. Barry Zito beat Santana in the playoffs last year, you not going to tell me that the A's lucked out when that happened?

My point is the Yankees need to stop going after every superstar out there. It creates undue pressure and a team without chemistry. The Yanks should not trade away all their young talent for Santana even if it means the Red Sox will get him. The front office should show some patience with these young players and develop them into homegrown stars who can deal with pressure because they would have learned to play with that pressure the whole time in the majors. Look how much patience the Yanks had with other young players in the past such as Bernie Williams, Andy Pettitte, Mariano Rivera... During the Dynasty years the Yanks resisted the urge to sign Albert Bell (a 50 homerun hitter) instead of Bernie. The Yanks also resisted the urge to trade Pettitte in 1999 when he was having a bad year. It takes a team to win a championship. If the yanks add anything this year it should be a bullpen.

by SirShadow on Nov 29, 2007 7:10 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

we've been saying this

ad nauseum on here.

SO WELCOME!! Just don't talk Arod contract and what's wrong with it or the Village Voice and what's right with it and you'll do fine.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Nov 29, 2007 10:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well, to be more precise,

bxgrl and a small majority have been saying that (don't touch the Trinity to get Santana) ad nauseum. But there's a vocal minority (like me!) who fondly recall the scene in The Untouchables when Elliot Ness's g-man accountant and the Capone stool pigeon get aced in the elevator. In blood, Capone's men write across the elevator:

Touchable.

Those are my feelings about Hughes, and even Joba, in the right scenario.

(Cue the boos.)

But bxgrl's right about the Village Voice being a poor source of baseball knowledge.

(Cue aroth's tourette's breakout.)

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Nov 29, 2007 11:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Boo!

I say Joba's untouchable - the Yankees would be fools to get rid of him for anybody.

They should hold onto Hughes, but maybe under the right circumstances....maybe. They'd have to be extraordinary circumstances, though. Admittedly, this is a softening of my hardcore Don't Trade Hughes stance from posts past.

I'd be okay trading IPK.

But any way you look at it, trading any one of these three will hurt. Someday, it'll bite us in the ass.

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I actually

was up for trading Kennedy but I don't want the Yankees screwed in a trade and that seems like what it comes down to.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Nov 30, 2007 5:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I will half boo

For me, anyone but Cano and Joba is tradeable in the right deal. If Boston gets Beckett, you can pretty much pencil them in for several more rings in the coming decade. Keeping that from happening is worth moving a Hughes or IPK to me.

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 30, 2007 8:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I actually wouldn't touch

those guys either, but that would've made the movie allusion less effective.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Nov 30, 2007 11:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Plus, I think

you meant Santana, not Becket. Unless, of course, Becket has a stealth opt-out clause.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Nov 30, 2007 11:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Oops, you're right

My bad

Fear the Evil Empire

by pfistyunc on Nov 30, 2007 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Speaking of Boston

Solid job by the Knicks tonight. A 35 foot shot at the buzzer cut the lead to 45. Celtics 104, Knicks 59. Sweet mother of christ.

If Isiah STILL has his job when I wake up tomorrow I have to believe he is holding a Dolan family member hostage at an u ndisclosed location.

If not tomorrow, what the hell is it gonna take? For most owners, even if the guy was winning he'd be gone with the sexual harrassment thing. What a joke. They should just pull someone out of the stands like in "Eddie".

First the Sox, now the Pats and the Celtics, this is too much to friggin take.

by matthaggs on Nov 29, 2007 11:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Glad I"m not an NBA fan

I'd be forced to root for the Knicks. What a shit team.

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 11:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Knicks

It was a fucking joke tonight.... terrible.

"It's great to be young and a Yankee"

by stillmonster on Nov 30, 2007 12:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Is Isiah still in charge over there?

It is admirable (or masochistic?) that you are actually paying attention to the Knicks these days. I tuned out about halfway into the Larry Brown season.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Nov 30, 2007 11:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Isiah

said he doesn't listen to the boo's because the people who are booing don't know what they're booing at.

Nothing like alienating the people who still go to the Garden. He is such a tool.

I hate what they've done to that franchise and the Dolans deserve to be run out of town.

pssst....Hank, wanna buy a basketball team???

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Nov 30, 2007 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The NBA should force a sale

Sort of like when the European soccer teams get relegated to the minor leagues. Jim Dolan is the worst owner I've over experienced.

I always feel pressure. What I don't have is fear. -- El Duque

by LateInningRelief on Nov 30, 2007 11:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

This in from the NY Times

The Yankees have offered pitcher Ian Kennedy, center fielder Melky Cabrera and at least one minor league prospect, perhaps outfielder José Tabata. In the trade discussions, the Yankees have told the Twins that pitcher Joba Chamberlain is untouchable and that they do not want to deal pitcher Phil Hughes.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/30/sports/baseball/30santana.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogi n

Looks like the front office is holding firm on Hughes. Good for them. I don't think BOS will cave on Ellsbury. In that case, I think IPK/Melky is more attractive to MIN.

by docgonzo on Nov 29, 2007 11:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Stand by first offer

NYY should not blink just because Bosox is about to get him by including Hughes and others to the mix. If I were Minnesota, I would not want Coco Crisp. I think Minnesota is playing a game to get untouchables from either NYY or Bosox such as Hughes and Buchholz. Either Bosox or NYY will blink though.

by yankeesintexas on Nov 30, 2007 12:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with this

Usually when the season ends I'm glad I'm not suffering heart attacks any more...but this year I'm somehow heart attack prone into December.

Make it stop.

"The secret of managing is to keep the guys who hate you away from the guys who are undecided." -Casey Stengel

by bxgrl1 on Nov 30, 2007 5:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sox

I know they are perennially like number 2 in the league in payroll to the beloved yanks but what exactly is their financial situation? Are they capable/willing to pay Santana upwards of 150 mil over 6-7 years like the yankees would be? It seems to me that they arent and have made their offer and really are just trying to bait the yanks into giving up more than they want.

I cant imagine that the twins would want, as the principle pieces, a guy who lost his starting job to the untouchable rookie Ellsbury and A guy who just completed his first season coming off of cancer over Kennedy and melky.

I know its not the nicest thing to say and I hope it all works out for the guy, but picking up Lester seems to me to be a huuuuuuge risk in this scenario. Its not like they are trading boof bonser for him.

by seanp23 on Nov 30, 2007 10:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Getting greedy

Man the twins want some major players we have already included Melky and Hughes now they want some of best minor leauge prospects to. I mean come on they are going to get these great players develop them and then when their contracts are up they will be back in pinstripes. They Twins remind me of another MLB Farm Team not to long ago. Anyone remember? The Expos.

by Ali317 on Dec 2, 2007 12:59 AM EST reply actions 0 recs