I think Pinella is in for sure
Unless other team officials can talk The Boss out of it, or unless Torre, 66, agrees to resign in order to save face, sources said principal owner George Steinbrenner will replace the manager who was credited with returning the team to its fabled glory. Yankees General Manager Brian Cashman is expected to keep his job, as are most members of the front office. Torre may be offered another position within the organizatio
Sources said Steinbrenner lost his patience over the team's listless play in its division series loss to the Tigers - and Steinbrenner is not expected to wait long to make his move.
Sources told the Daily News that Piniella has been in discussions with the Chicago Cubs, San Francisco Giants and Washington Nationals, and Steinbrenner does not want the Yankees to miss a chance to sign the man considered the natural successor to Torre for years...
I'll write up my thoughts after I take a bit more time. I do think it's time for Joe to step down. The decision to squeeze Sheffield and Matsui back in to the mix after they missed almost the entire season had many of us spooked. And WE WERE RIGHT.
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The real problems
by nyerinfl on Oct 8, 2006 10:35 PM EDT reply actions
Agreed. George should just
George is getting really old...
by AKJoe on Oct 8, 2006 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Lupica put it best
I'm not saying Torre should be fired, and I'd take him as my manager in a second... but if you had 6 straight years of failure at your job, would you be able to keep it? From a Big Stein perspective, that's what it boils down to.
Lou says:
-quote from Lou in the pregame show for the Cards/Padres game
by Fett42 @ Pinstripe Alley on Oct 8, 2006 10:58 PM EDT reply actions
Though this version of the article
by Fett42 @ Pinstripe Alley on Oct 8, 2006 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Good Question - who leaked?
by Al Rodgers on Oct 9, 2006 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Screw saving face
I'm sure Lou has been in touch, all the more reason I would make George fire him.
If you want Pinella that bad then make it happen and be prepared to pay because it will cost you a lot on a number of fronts so be prepared to weather the storm.
Take it from a longtime Mariners fan...
Fiery? Sure. throwing a base into right field now and then can fire up the clubhouse. But his track record with both managing pitching and handling young players is -bad-.
I can't tell you how many young pitching prospects Sweet Lou chewed up and spit out during his tenure in the Northwest. If he's hired, say goodbye to Mr. Hughes.
True
by Fett42 @ Pinstripe Alley on Oct 9, 2006 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions
How many bases will Lou toss next year?
by Al Rodgers on Oct 9, 2006 12:22 AM EDT reply actions
ya know, I thought Randolph would be the successor
by Al Rodgers on Oct 9, 2006 12:45 AM EDT reply actions
I thought the
by Edwantsacracker on Oct 9, 2006 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Lou Piniella
As it is, there's no denying the fact that Piniella is a horrible at managing young pitchers. His track record with the Seattle Mariners and Tampa Bay Devil Rays during the 1990s and early 2000s is proof of that.
In the end, ultimately, Hughes would be mentally abused and physically overused via Piniella's impatience.
Pinella is not the answer
I think Torre made some bad decisions in the division series but I don't think Pinella is the answer.
You maybe
Torre isn't the problem on this team
Yes, he's a fiery guy and that's great for a younger team, but not a ballclub loaded with veterans because that will get old fast and cause more tension sooner rather than later.
IMHO, so many people took Torre for granted and dismissed his ability to diffuse controversy on the biggest stage in the land, rather than escalate it. Piniella is almost the opposite of Torre in that respect.
The reason why that SI article created such a buzz last month was because this Yankee team under Torre kept all of the clubhouse stuff inside the clubhouse as it is supposed to be.
The reaction by the media would have been far different if this kind of thing and clubhouse "turmoil" (for a lack of a better word) was the norm instead of a rarity over the last decade.
All of that professionalism that has been the Yankee way during the last 11 seasons is because of Torre.
I don't see that happening under Piniella.
Also, I think it's worth noting that Piniella hasn't exactly been in the middle of too many postseason celebrations in his own right.
He's already been the manager of the Yankees -- TWICE -- and I don't remember him having too much success.
He was also the manager of a team in Seattle that broke the AL record for wins in a single season in 2001 and were the favorites to win the World Series that season.
Well, that didn't work out so well for Sweet Lou because the M's got beat by the Yankees in the ALCS; a series they were favored to win.
Yankee fans have been so spoiled over the last decade that they seem to forget that the Yanks had been to a grand total of ONE postseason in the previous 15 years before Torre arrival and he helped deliver nothing but success and postseason appearances since the day he put on the pinstripes.
Torre had 11 straight playoff appearances, 9 straight division titles, 6 AL Pennants, and 4 rings during his tenure and some people think he's a worthless bum.
That doesn't make a damn bit of sense to me.
Let's not forget what the man did for this franchise before we kick him while he's down and toss him out the door like yesterday's trash.
Unfortunately, I don't think many Yankee fans will truly appreciate what the man did for this team until he's gone and his successor fails to get the Yankees to the postseason.
Just like the Atlanta Braves and their reign in the NL East, it's gonna happen eventually.
Torre has
The last time
Piniella
Mattingly and Girardi would both be great choices, since they work well with the younger players, yet have played the game recently enough that they can connect with the veterans.
Editorializing the Yanks since 2005.
by PinstripePowerhouse on Oct 9, 2006 12:03 PM EDT reply actions
Donny Baseball
The SI article
THe access given for that article broke the trust of the players for the concept of what happens in the clubhouse, stays in the clubhouse.
Torre should never, and in the past I don't think he would ever, have allowed such a story/such access.
As for Arod - he needs to understand that God does not give a rat's ass about whether it is time for him to 'produce'. God gave him the ability to hit the ball six miles, and God expects him to USE that ability to, well, hit the ball six miles.
I think Piniella would be a substantial error in judgment. Lou's a great player, but he's not a great manager (imo). With the potential to completely rebuild the roster, bring up younger players, and TEACH the game again - that's what Torre did well in the 90s.
But since 2001 when we went back to buying OTPs, Torre hasn't been able to do that. And the OTP'ers have done nothing in the postseason to deliver wins:
Giambi
(Damon - in brackets due to 3R HR in game 2)
Johnson
Wright
Sheffield
Rodriguez
Mussina
Matsui (technically an OTP'er)
They have all been horrible in the postseason. None have delivered timely hits/starts consistently.
But our one win in this series came from the homegrown guys -- Jeter 5-5 (who is consistent), Wang (not great but good enough), and the other HG'er Posada who had a good series at the plate.
I would prefer not to see Piniella manage the Yankees into the ground next year - regardless of how many times he kissed Arod on the forehead.
Great logic
I know, I know: Posada, Jeter, Williams, Rivera, Pettitte, Mendoza, Lehritz.
And if the Yanks had won the ALDS, we'd be talking about how this tighter knit clubhouse was uneffected by the negative SI article. Chemistry is a product, not an ingredient to championships.
Right on
Truer words have never been spoken.
Editorializing the Yanks since 2005.
by PinstripePowerhouse on Oct 10, 2006 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Torre has been great
Jeter says no to Joe go
I do think he should have pitched Wang on game 4 and that he should have put Andy Phillips at first.
I don't know what is wrong with Torre that led him to these decisions but someone should find out and fix it.
I do like the professionalism of this team and how everything (sans the SI article) stays in the clubhouse and I think Lou would undo all of that.
They need to get more coaches into more active roles on the bench the way Zim was. I assume the coaches and players knew that Wright and Sheffield were bad ideas. Since me and everyone i know knew it, I assume they did. I was screaming about Wright and Sheffield before the game. hell, who couldn't see that loss coming?
I think Joe is amazing but some of his calls are just screwy sometimes. He needs better people around him who can say "Hold it...let's think about this."
Andy Phillips would of made the difference....
by AKJoe on Oct 10, 2006 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Joe's Strenght, And A Little Dose Of Reality
A friend of mine, not even remotely close to being a Yankee fan (hating them, in fact), acknowledges that the Yankees early in Torre's tenure was a team, a true team, not just a collection of stars, like the current Yankees. Is this Torre's fault? Yes and no. If Torre is to get some credit for the titles, he should get some demerits for the team's failings.
Will hiring a new manager cure the Yankees' ills? Well, let's look at this realistically for a moment-- not Yankee fan/media reality but real-world reality-- here is a team that has won the division title every year for nine straight years and playing in five World Series with a record of 3-2 in those series. Take a look at this for a moment.... 5 World Series appearances in nine years.... 3 World Series won in nine years.... Truth be told, Yankee fans, losing as your team has been losing should not be embarrassing, at all. Your team was a part of history in 2004-- on the wrong side, however. You lost to an Angels team in 2005 that has had your team's number for years, so that is not shocking. In 2006, you got beat by good pitching. Kenny Rogers' start was shocking, to be sure. But Detroit was a good team this season, on the whole, who did play badly in their last 50 games. Detroit's victory is not shocking, is not a sign of the end times, or anything like that. It was a loss to a team that just played better-- which is how it works out most of the time. Baseball has been like that for years, and will continue to be that way.
The fact that the Yankees haven't won a World Series since 2000 is not terrible, shocking, embarrassing, unfathomable, or any other adjective you want to use in that vein. I mean this in a baseball-reality sense. In a Yankee fan/media reality, the end is nigh. What does that tell us? The fault lies not in your stars but in yourselves.
They will be back one day. That day may not come that soon but it will happen. The Yankees have too many resources at their disposal to not reach the promised land again one day. You do have a little work to do. Sheffield should be a goner, you will need some pitching (who doesn't nowadays? That is another subject for another time....), and you will need a little luck. And there are probably other little things that need to happen.
For fans who have forgotten, or fans who have never experienced this, just remember, or get to know, the drought that existed from 1982 to 1994. In that timespan, there were no World Series, no Division titles, and only a couple of season where these were possible. Hey, let's go back farther than that, where the previous drought was from 1965 to 1975. We can go back farther than that, the timespan of 1901 to 1920. This proves that the Yankees don't win the World Series every year.
They'll be back. When the time, and the team, is right, they'll be back. Once in awhile, it's good to know how the other half lives-- you'll appreciate the titles more.
Durr durr durr
The clear and obvious problem in NY is pitching. You guys don't spend money on good pitching normally, but then when you do, it's on a forty year old man!
Steinbrenner is a shit.
by TruthtoPower on Oct 9, 2006 1:57 PM EDT reply actions
My Dear Sir....
A quick thought: Never saw a post like this on the Amazin' Avenue blog.... I hope this caliber of reply is more the exception rather than the rule.

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